The More Things Change...Thoughts on Andrea Bargnani at Eurobasket 2011
Andrea Bargnani averaged 22 points in Eurobasket 2011...but was his performance one for Raptors' fans to get excited about? The HQ discusses...
Happy Labour Day all, it's been a while since we talked about anything too Raptors basketball related.
Sure, we've been talking about the Raptors as an organization a lot, and will continue to do so, but there hasn't been much in the way of on-court topics to discuss ever since the Raps failed to make the 2011 NBA playoffs.
However with basketball in full swing in various international tournaments, it gives us a chance to check in on some members of the Dinos who are participating.
In other words, real basketball talk!
As a team with a number of international players, the Raps each off-season tend to have lots of "real basketball talk" luckily, even in the summer's dog days. Currently, Andrea Bargnani, Jonas Valanciunas, and Jose Calderon are partaking in Eurobasket 2011, and was Linas Kleiza not still recovering from injury, he'd probably be joining Valanciunas on the Lithuanian team and playing too.
(As an aside, there are a good number of former Raptors like Uros Slokar and Marco Belinelli involved in the tourney too. Not to mention Omar Cook running point for Montenegro...HUH?)
But it's Andrea Bargnani that I want to spend some time on today.
Yes, Bargs, and even as I pen, or type, this piece, I can hear the Andrea backers and dissenters drawing their swords, preparing to do battle.
In fact it was dissenting comments regarding Bargnani's play in Italy's first four Eurobasket games that inspired this little piece.
Specifically, many readers noted that Andrea's performance in Eurobasket was exactly like his performance with his NBA team; all offense and that's about it.
When I read these comments, I couldn't help but feel disappointed.
I'm of the opinion that tournaments like Eurobasket should be great opportunities for international NBAers to show the full array of their games. Unchained from NBA playbooks, facing mostly inferior competition, and playing with many teammates that they're extremely familiar with, it's a good chance for them to get the confidence flowing and truly show what they are capable of.
So to hear that it was same old same old for Andrea, was at face value disappointing.
However I had yet to see any of the action myself, so decided to check out a few sites like Hoopsrumors, where it was quite possible to watch games in almost their entirety. In fact, the first thing I took a look at were some of the highlights of Andrea's 22 points in Italy's loss to France:
"Um...hold up...was that Bargs faking out Joakim Noah, driving the lane and throwing it down?"
"Hard to be too upset with that," I thought.
The other highlights were pretty much run-of-the-mill Bargs, curls, pull-up J's, long-range 3's etc, and failed to show anything in the way of miscues.
It was time to take a trip to the box score.
Not so bad there either.
Andrea did shoot 9 of 15 in the game, so this wasn't a case of Bargnani chucking it up 25 times to get his 22 points. His squad appeared to have just come up short to a France team that even minus Tony Parker during the fourth quarter, is still chalk-full of NBA vets.
In fact based on the game recap and some online footage that I found, Bargs had a shot to put his Italian squad ahead with about a minute left, but his 3-pointer rimmed out, and France never looked back.
So how about the rest of his tournament?
Well, through four games, Bargnani's averaging 22 points (fourth best in the tourney), 6.5 rebounds and 2 blocks. Again, if one of your team's best players is putting up numbers like that, at face value, it's hard to complain.
He's also shooting 45 per cent from the field while taking a high volume of shots per game, not too shabby for most team's top options. (Kobe Bryant shot 45 per cent last season.)
But as I dove deeper and deeper into the Eurobasket stats and footage, I began to realize that again, the same problems I had with Andrea as an NBA player, were rearing their ugly heads here in Eurobasket action.
First, 45 per cent isn't bad for a shooting guard or small forward...but Andrea's not a shooting guard.
Nor a small forward or even power one.
He's listed as a center on Italy's depth chart, one of only two, and considering his size and skill advantage down low, I would have expected his field goal percentage to be closer to that 50 per cent mark. His 45 per cent mark is almost equal to his 44.1 per cent NBA career FG mark.
He's also attempted just over three triples a game so far in Eurobasket, just about on par with his season last year in Toronto, where he took 3.4 a match.
And funny that he only averaged five boards in the loss to France.
Last season he only averaged 5.2 on the year so while that "6.5 rebounds a game" stat for the tourney to date looks ok, the last game could be a sign of regression to the mean so to speak.
Yep, it was quickly becoming clear as to what the comments of "the same Andrea" were all about. Statistically, albeit only through four games, Andrea's European adventure was beginning to look like a carbon copy of his North American one.
More concerning though to me again was the big picture.
In a game where Italy desperately needed someone to own the glass, Andrea couldn't get the job done. The result was a 38 to 19 shellacking on the boards, including the Italians giving up 11 offensive rebounds.
And that folks was the story of the game in a nutshell.
Watch replays and you see a lot of the same thing in terms of Andrea and his style of boxing out that you're probably quite familiar with. It's not like every rebound was easily accessible to him, or it was entirely his fault that the rebounding discrepancy ended up being what it was...but you watch and you again just want to see him be more involved at that end. There's not much more you can say.
And maybe the 6.5 rebounds a game wouldn't be such a concern if someone else on Italy was making like Reggie Evans and hauling in 13 a match, but that's not been the case.
Indeed, we're seeing the same old Andrea, the one who's filling it up on offence, but as his team's marquee player, just not doing enough to help his team win.
The rebounding, dreadful assist to turnover ratio and the like are still just stats but the bottom line is that again, Italy, thanks to the loss to France, will not be participating in post-season action, something all too familiar to Toronto Raptor fans.
Is this completely Andrea's fault?
Of course not.
He's got a few chuckers as teammates who probably aren't helping matters at times, but as Italy's main gun, he's the one who should be shouldering the load at both ends, looking to motivate his club, make key plays, inspire the troops and carry it to victory.
Instead, an all too familiar fourth quarter against France where he failed to score, or have much of an impact at all on the game's outcome.
Andrea is without a doubt one of the more talented players in the tournament, playing on a team with legitimate NBA talent, and facing very few defenders who can keep him in check.
So while the 22 points per game looks good, again, I can't help but watch "Il Mago" in action and find myself wanting more.
A lot more.
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If Bargs can’t get motivated to step up his game for his country, good luck expecting him to play any differently for the Raptors. Bargnani is what he is and it’s obvious that’s not going to change.
by RaptorsHQ - Defensive Stance on Sep 5, 2011 9:19 AM EDT reply actions
ISTM That The Main Take Away From All This Is
He is what he is.
There is no more upside in Bargnani’s game or at the best very little.
He is not a starter on a NBA team that wants to got deep in the playoffs.
He is a sixth man who can come off the bench and put up some quick points in the middle of a game, nothing more and it is highly unlikely he will ever be more than this even though he will become only 26 in October.
Finding his role
I agree, that we are unlikely to see any significant change in Bargnani’s game in the future. Whether it is as a part of the Raptors or (preferably) on another team, the key to getting the most out of him will be slotting him into a role that is suitable to his talents. Perhaps sixth man or whatever.
I am absolutely
mind boggled this article only has 2 posts in it so far (3 now).
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Sep 6, 2011 7:54 AM EDT reply actions
Not me. We’ve been over it and over it. There’s no more to say. Until the season starts, we only have old conversations, especially where the unchanging Bargs is concerned – if he did something different in this tourney, there could be a discussion, but I expect with both he and Jose, there won’t be enough to generate any new ideas.
Jonas is a whole other matter. Looking forward to that post.
Was thinking the same thing NSFS, but maybe after fiver years, as Dhackett notes, “there’s no more to say.”
I think I’d reached that conclusion a while ago but I was indeed curious to see if we’d see a spike in “all-around dominance” in this tourney, especially since he’s playing less athletic types that give him issues in the NBA, and he’s been playing with these same teammates for years.
No go…
And yeah, Jonas and Jose up next…
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Sep 6, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions
I think it also has to do with the fact there are so few Bargnani defenders left and so very few logical arguments left (if any) to defend him.
For the most part .... I agree
You just needed to add a few words to your comments. And while I’m at it, I’ve added my reasons:
- I think it also has to do with the fact there are so few Bargnani defenders left [ visiting here ] – as we’ve gone from a reason to debate, to a reason not to bother.
- so very few logical arguments left [ because what’s the point ] – we (Raptor and Bargnani fans) just don’t enjoy it anymore.
The only reason I’ve stuck around, is cause I’m too stubborn stupid to know better. Or maybe I’m an optimist, and hope that a great opportunity to discuss my favourite team will turn around.
.
by RapthoseLeafs on Sep 6, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Ah! I knew there were one or two left…
by MAS11 on Sep 6, 2011 1:10 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I Would Wait On Doing A Report On Jonas
Until September 19th or after LTU is eliminated from the EuroBasket 2011.
LTU First Game Second Round
tomorrow vs Serbia.
Game starts at 2:00 PM EDT
Might be on ESPN.go.com/watchespn/
http://espn.go.com/watchespn/index/_/source/espn3/#type/upcoming/
After the EuroBasket 2011 is complete I will do a short write-up of what I saw comparing Jonas with Enes.
That would be interesting Buddah – haven’t seen anything of Enes yet.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Sep 6, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions
C. Sheridan ESPN Says NBA Teams Will Play 2 Pre-season games and Full Schedule
this season
Oct. 1: An agreement is reached on aggregate dollars.
Oct. 4: All remaining issues are settled.
Oct. 5-19: The agreement is put into writing.
Oct. 20: Free agency opens and players already under contract are allowed to report to their teams.
Oct. 21-31: Training camps are held, and each team plays two exhibition games.
Nov. 1: The season opens on time, with three games: Bulls-Mavericks and Thunder-Lakers in a TNT doubleheader, along with Rockets-Jazz.
http://sheridanhoops.com/2011/09/05/nba-lockout-update-sides-are-closer-than-theyre-saying/
Sounds promising…but I’m waiting until I see something from Woj or someone else like that first.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Sep 6, 2011 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Just FYI – Sheridan is no longer with ESPN.
by dhackett1565 on Sep 6, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions
And is suing folks for defamation and all this garbage…
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Sep 6, 2011 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Thanks For The Heads Up
That is what I get for not watching ESPN
Well rarely watching it. LOL
I was just reading that article
He does make some valid points no? I found it at least alil bit of hope to have a season. Ratings, merchandise, and attendace all went up last season would just wouldn’t make sense to cancel a full season now.
by sherwin316 on Sep 6, 2011 11:41 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
No he certainly does. As much as some of Sheridan’s recent work I’ve found to be full of rantings and bitterness over his current situation, that one pretty much stuck to the facts.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Sep 6, 2011 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Chris Sheridan Leaves ESPN.com To Start New Site
by Tom Ziller • Sep 6, 2011 5:47 AM PDT
Best of luck to Chris Sheridan, a grizzled ESPN.com reporter who has left the Worldwide Leader to start his own web venture, SheridanHoops. (Pretty apt name!) Sheridan covered the NBA for the Associated Press for many years before joining ESPN; he most recently has focused on New York for the WWL’s regional projec
Yeah that’s a good one ha ha.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Sep 6, 2011 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions




























