NBA Free Agency 2011 - Top Shooting Guard Options for the Toronto Raptors
by Adam Francis on Jul 8, 2011 12:00 PM EDT
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PrintFrom the small forward options we move to the shooting guards...
Is DeMar DeRozan the next Eddie Jones?
The next Harold Miner?
How about Vernon Maxwell?
Before jumping into a discussion about possible free agent additions for the Toronto Raptors at the shooting guard spot, these are very pertinent questions.
If you feel DeMar's going down the path of an Eddie Jones, then upgrading the shooting guard position this off-season probably isn't a top priority of yours.
If however you think we've got Baby Jordan part two on our hands...
I'm not sold on DeMar as of yet but like the fact that he's worked extremely hard to keep improving. And while a lot of this improvement didn't show up via advanced stats, there's no doubting how far he came in just one season in terms of attacking the basket and knocking down his mid-range J. Yep, he's got lots of work to do on the defensive end and in terms of hitting the 3, but we're still talking about a young player with a ton of upside so the question then remains, are there truly better options out there in terms of upgrading the 2?
Let's take a look.
The "I'll Hug Colangelo" Tier:
1) No one - Looking at some of the "marquee names" in this class at the 2, there just aren't any that scream "sign him."
Jason Richardson? Do you really want to pay top dollar for a player who relies a lot on athleticism, entering the downside of his career?
Michael Redd? J Rich part II but with an injury record that's starting to seem like Grant Hill.
Jamal Crawford? Sure, like Richardson he could help stretch the floor but at what cost? And would you really start him over DeMar?
JR Smith? The last thing a young team like the Raps needs is someone like Smith jacking up shots on the court and potentially causing a stir off of it.
No thanks to all, let's move along.
The "Nice Work if you Can Get It" Tier:
1) Arron Afflalo - Now we're talking.
Afflalo has a qualifying offer price tag of $2.9M so assuming Denver lets him walk, he'd indeed be within Toronto's price range.
That's a big assumption though considering how valuable Afflalo is as both a defensive stopper and floor spacer, and at only 25 years of age, will likely have a number of teams looking to hire him should the Nuggets decide not to retain his services.
It's hard not to think that he wouldn't be a great addition to Toronto though if possible. He wouldn't constantly need the ball in his hands to be effective, could come in off the bench backing up the 2 or 3, and as RapsRepub noted recently, would help shore up the perimeter defence, an obvious sore spot for TO.
2) Wilson Chandler - Like Afflalo, Chandler is another player the Nuggets are going to have to make a decision on retaining. He's got a $3.1M qualifying offer and is due for a big raise, but could still be affordable for the Raps if again, Denver decides to go in another direction.
Chandler isn't the defender that Afflalo is, but he's got all the physical tools to be a factor in that area, plus at 6-8 would give the Raps another player who could man the 2 or 3 spot. He can score, slash to the basket, rebound the ball, and basically would provide the Dinos that prototypical swingman that most top NBA clubs have in their employment. His PER has always been a bit undewhelming, but this is a player I'd be pretty happy to have in a Raptors' uniform next season. Again though...at the right price.
The "Fine, I Guess That Works" Tier:
1) No One - In our small forward breakdown I asked:
Are guys like James Jones, Al Thornton, Earl Clark and Rodney Carney really upgrades over James Johnson or even a healthy Linas Kleiza?
The same is true here.
Are guys like Daequan Cook, Nick Young, DeShawn Stevenson, Delonte West, Roger Mason Jr., and Marco Belinelli an upgrade over DeMar?
Not in my books.
The "These Guys are Kind of Interesting" Tier:
1) Mike Dunleavy Jr. - From the list of shooting guard free-agent options, we're now at the point where we turn to the back-up or, "he might be interesting" portion. Tops for me on this list is Jr. Dun, a player who has battled injuries for some time now, but doesn't rely on athleticism to be effective. He's still someone who can make players around him better thanks to his passing, can spread the floor with his shooting, and has a great basketball IQ. If he's available for a couple season at the right price, I think you could do a lot worse.
2) Anthony Parker - Sure, he's not the defensive force he once was but I think there's a bit of gas let in the tank. He can stretch an opponent's D, come in off the bench, and provide much needed veteran leadership - perfect for one of those final bench spots.
3) Tracy McGrady - Here me out. T-Mac actually had decent numbers last year considering the amount of time he played. He's 32, and obviously a shell of his former self athletically, but for the vet minimum I'm not sure why you wouldn't take a flier on him considering the other options out there. Oh yeah, that whole "starting a player's revolt last season" thing...
4) Gary Forbes - This former UMASS star had a nice season with the Nuggets last year, flying under the radar after college but finding a niche in the NBA as a Lee Nailon type scorer. He's a restricted free agent, but the Nuggets may take a pass considering all the other players they need to keep. If so, I think Mr. Forbes would be worth a look.
5) Von Wafer - Von Wafer has always been a bit like Chris Douglas-Roberts for me. With the right team, i think he could flourish as there just aren't many players with his combination of scoring ability and athleticism. He's a bit of JR Smith light, right down to the off-court baggage, but the hope would be that Wafer realizes he's running out of time to make his mark in the L, and a club like the Raps could take advantage of his skillset.
The "Just Say No" Tier:
See options in the "Fine, I Guess That Work" Tier.
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Revolutionary idea...
We bring back T-Mac as a backup SG and Vince as a reserve SF…
Reunited they are born again!
… cricket … cricket …
"the Truth"
Looking at this picture, as repugnant as it is, I can’t help but think what an oportunity these two bozos missed out on. Imagine if they stayed with the Raps and Grunwald was able to build around them… I think the fortunes of the Raps would have been a bit different. Alas…
It was too ridiculous for me to pass up... but yea, they could have built something special...
"the Truth"
Love the idea – Aaron Afflalo.
Hate the idea – Dunleavey. Franchise, I know he’s an ex-Dukie, so I’ll excuse you bias on this : ) But Dunleavey is a turrrrrible NBA player. Everyone thinks he’s a good shooter, but he’s not. Career 44% from the field and 36% from 3pt range, nothing to write home about especially considering his abhorrent defence. Not sure where you got that he was a good passer from…. He’s basically a 6 -9 Bargnani. No thanks…
agree with Dunleavy
he had 1 good season… flash in the pan, like all Duke players
…. waiting for it…..
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jul 8, 2011 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
DraftExpress Jonathan Givony
Paul Hewitt: “the 3-point shot is a great equalizer. Russia outscored us 12-0 there. That’s tough to overcome.”
57 minutes ago
The best option is Afflalo
I would trade DeMar for him straight up, no questions asked.
I Will Always Vote To Replace A Trojan With A Bruin
To do otherwise in my household would be heresy of the greatest magnitude. LOL
by Buddahfan on Jul 8, 2011 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Need I Add That I Am A Bruin Alumnus - Really
Go Bruins
by Buddahfan on Jul 8, 2011 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hey Buddah
Just curious why a So Cal guy such as yourself follows the Raps so closely. Don’t get me wrong, I think its AWESOME and like having you around, just curious.
I’m guessing here, and am interested in Buddah’s story, but I believe it was Amir who drew him here.
Its Not Quite That Simple
Amir did not attract me to this sight. When I started posting here I was already following the Raptors and posting over on Raptors Republic. I decided to post more here though occasionally I still post over there on the outside
I have always followed the Raptors since I am originally from Buffalo, N.Y. and spent a lot of time in Toronto during my college years. In fact I was seriously thinking about moving there after college but my mother lived here in So. CA so I moved there instead.
The Amir story is an amalgam of favorites.
1. Amir played high school ball just down the freeway from where I live
2. He was Mr. Basketball in CA
3. He was drafted by the Pistons who I had followed for a very long time as my favorite team. So when you combine the three it was a natural that I would follow him
4. I have always liked the effort he gives on the court
5. He seems to be a nice guy. I like nice people.
6. I think over the last three years he has been kind of thrown under the bus though not so much now but he still has a large doubters club. I still think he has potential to become a significant all-around impact player which doesn’t mean putting up huge numbers in scoring and rebounding but having a positive influence on his team’s fortunes.
7. Habit – LOL
Well good to have you around
And LOL @ “He seems to be a nice guy. I like nice people.”
Loved that one.
I Forgot One
He eats advanced stats whether he is coming in off the bench or starting.
In 2010-11 of all the players in the NBA who started at least 50 games and are listed at 6’9" or more Centers, PF and few SF which totaled 53 he had the the following stats on offense
1. 2nd best Offensive Rating – Top 4%
2. 6th best TS% – Top 12%
3. 7th best eFG% – Top 14%
4. 9th best ORB% – Top 18%
5. 18th best FT% – Top 36%
6. 19th best WS/48 – Top 38%
7. 24th best PER – Top 48%
He just needs to drop his foul rate more which he dropped last season to 5.1 per 36 minutes from 6.3 per 36 minutes the previous season. In addition his foul rate per 36 minutes as a starter was even lower at 4.8 fouls per 36 minutes as a starter.
So he went from a bench player in 2009-10 when committed 6.3 fouls per 36 minutes to a starter in 2010-11 when he committed 4.8 fouls per 36 minutes. Nice improvement if I do say so myself.
His progress in fouls per 36 minutes
2008-09 6.8
2009-10 6.3
2010-11 4.8 as a starter
More
Despite playing the last month and half of last season on only one good ankle he was 30th in the entire league in 1 Year Overall Unadjusted Rating
In 2009-10 he was 26th best in the league in 1 Year Overall Unadjusted Rating
http://basketballvalue.com/topplayers.php?year=2009-2010&mode=summary&sortnumber=21&sortorder=DESC
To think that some people still think that he is a role player destined to come off the bench. SMH
hahaha, yes!
Go Bruins!
Bias aside, Afflalo is actually a pretty decent player….would be great on the Raps.
Would consider it if it somehow also brought a 1st round pick and ...
no there just isn’t any reasonable way to make it work…
"the Truth"
I Would Like To See Jones Added
as the fifth guard.
Replace DeRozan with Afflalo and add Jones three point shooting. That would give the Raptors five guards who can shoot and make the three ball and would be an upgrade in the Raptors defense.
BC make it so
You Have At Least One Real Problem That Needs To Be Looked At By A Professional
seriously.
Think about it and get some help, please.
I am all for a return of McGrady for a cheap price on a very short contract. You all may think I am nuts but his ability to play 3 positions and his veteran presence would be a boon to this team. Plus he has always been a decent defender. Throw in the fact that if he has a decent year a playoff team might throw a late round pick to us to get add him and now we are talking. Best case, he beats barney to death and makes the Raptors worse on the court.
Tmac beating barney to death and making the Raptors worse on the court are mutualy exclusive, right?
You mean BAD veteran presence? Just because he’s a veteran, doesn’t make him a good veteran presence. He’s never been a hard worker, has never been a leader and hasn’t been a decent defender in a few years. Best case…he doesn’t get signed. Worst case, he either performs well enough to take time away from players that should get the minutes, or he becomes a bad influence in the locker room.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
I gotta go with Tim on this
McCradle is not my idea of a Leader type – and offers little upside in coming to Toronto.
.
If Raptors are going to bring a former player back , I’d love to see Anthony Parker sporting dinosaur duds. He could spell in the place of locked in Sonny, be a veteran presence to the team – a young team, plus add some 3 point shooting.
.
by RapthoseLeafs on Jul 8, 2011 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Nick Young
Is an interesting option. He’s one of the only players on that list that can get you that 30- or 40-point game on his own. He can only do one thing (score), and he tends to be streaky, but he can definitely be a Kevin Martin type.
When did DD show he can score 40 a night?
In a game against the Houston Rockets, DeRozan scored a career high 37 points
"the Truth"
That is 3 shy and doing it once hardly makes you a potential star. Just ask Charlie V who scored 48 twice including once in his rookie year.
The comment was that Nick Young has the ability to get 30 or 40 points on his own...
DeRozan getting 37 shows he has the ability to do the same…
Fairly easy to understand I would think…
None of the comments were about the “star quality” of a player…
"the Truth"
Nobody said ANYTHING about scoring 40 ppg every night...
Apparently you think Nick Young is the best scorer in the history of the league…
Foolish…
"the Truth"
I never said any such thing. I was speaking about Derozans ability to score 30-40 per game or even on a semi regular basis. He just has not show that kind of ability as far as I am concerned and I likened his 37 to Charlie V and his 48’s. The words Nick Young never actually left my keyboard.
Nobody was talking about DeMar scoring 30-40 PER GAME...
The statement was that Nick Young had the ability to have A GAME of 30-40 points… which I then showed DeMar demonstrating the same ability…
Then you show up disputing my comparison, saying that DeMar won’t score 30-40 PER GAME… THEREFORE IMPLYING that Nick Young CAN score 30-40 PER GAME…
So either you came into our discussion and told me I’m wrong about something I wasn’t even discussing, OR you ARE talking about the same thing as we were and you think Nick Young is the greatest scorer the league has ever seen…
"the Truth"
-1
I can’t agree here… Nick Young has demonstrated an actual NBA-level skill – being able to consistent score.
At this point in his career, Derozan’s #1 skill is still “jumping really high”, which isn’t making his PER ranking any better.
The Raptors need more players that can do at least 1 thing at the level of an NBA starter. Right now, there are very few of these on the roster. Reggie Evans (rebounding) was one of the only ones last year, and he may be gone.
Consistant is not how I would describe Nick Young
He’s a bit of a chucker and a streak shooter
Chuckers usually are streaky shooters
unless you’re incredible
Nick Young is almost as good a defender as DeRozan. Take that as you will.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
DeRozan apparently was not a difference maker to last year's Raptors...
GP MIN FG% 3P% FT% REB AST BLK STL PTS
In wins 22 34.3 .497 .071 .784 4.1 2.0 0.4 0.9 17.0
In losses60 34.9 .457 .105 .823 3.8 1.8 0.4 1.1 17.3
"the Truth"
Yea, sorry if that seemed like a retort to your post... just needed a place to fit it in the conversation...
I wouldn’t trade DeMar for Nick at all…
I just came across that stat line and thought hey, for as crappy as he supposedly was on D and ballhandling and a shooting liability… he was a wash in his influence on the team winning…
Which means if he can make ANY improvements this off season, he stands to become a difference maker…
"the Truth"
Tmac
What’s the cost of signing Tmac? Are we all here a bit biased because of the good games he had last year against the Raps? One of those games he looked like an allstar.
Tmac can still play and would be useful but he’s not worth a lot to us at this time. I enjoy watching him play and could see Tmac in Toronto for a two year contract at the vet minimum, but not for much more. The problem here is that Tmac is unlikely to be part of our 5 year plan and that is the key for the team. So if you can get him cheap, than yes bring him in. He can back up DD or JJ and can help to start and set the expectations for the team higher.
BUT ONLY IF TMAC WANTS TO COME TO TORONTO. IF HE SEES IT AS A POSITIVE MOVE FOR HIM, SIGN HIM. IF HE IS NOT EXCITED TO COME HERE, DON’T BRING HIM IN.
So how could Tmac be excited to come to Toronto?
1. minutes, he wants to play and here he will get a chance
2. meaningful minutes, he should have a chance to be an impact player here
3. correct the past
4. he wants to be a leader on a young team and prove everyone else wrong
5. he wants to help turn the franchise and his career around, believes he can be a leader on this team and earn another contract in two more years when the team is a solid contender. In short, Tmac may think the Raps offer a good chance for him to redeem himself and revive his career.
Why he may not want to come to Toronto?
1. he wants to move on from his past
2. wants to play for a contender (but he may have a hard time finding a contender who will give him the minutes he requires.)
3. wants to be a starter
Interesting situation.
As for Nick Young, no thank you. His lack of defence is glaring and him playing beside Jose or Leandro would be a nightmare.
The beauty of Tmac here is that he can score or be a playmaker. Young is simply a scorer. Between DD & Andrea the ball stops enough already. Throw Young into the mix and we have three ball hogs on one team. Tmac passes very well and can make his teamates better, which is exactly what we need, as long as the price tag is not too steep, sign him up.
Tmac is not like DD at all. He is a great passer and can run the offence if needed. DD is improving and has lots of potential but he’s not a passer.
Tmac
I like McGateway’s idea of signing him, letting him play and be productive and then trading him for a draft pick to a playoff contender. If he works out, he should be desired by a few teams who are making a run for a ring and we can add a solid draft pick.
re: auditioning players at backup SG/SF to use as trade fodder later
This could be a good angle to take with the opportunity we have at backup SF and SG for the upcoming season. Weems and Kleiza are both out for the year, so there is an opportunity for someone to come in on a one year deal, and raise their profile. We give them the playing time, and trade them to a playoff contender at the deadline if the price is right.
The catch is that it would have to be a specialized role player. IMHO, jack of all trades types don’t garner much value around the trade deadline. Teams want players that have a definite NBA level skill so that they can be mixed and matched off the bench.
I am in the camp that doesn’t want want to see T-Mac back though. Not a part of Toronto history I want back, just like Jalen Rose. The media is always looking for a quote, and on a young team TMAC would be consulted often. IMHO, I think he’d run his mouth and become an annoyance over time. If we’re bringing in veterans, make them high character guys, not guys that still have a big ego without the game to match.
The hate for T-mac
I’ve never understood why Tracy McGrady received so much hate from Raptor fans. From what I recall, Grunwald lowballed him on an extension offer before his last season with us, he got offended, went out and had a very good season for us, and then bolted for max-money in his hometown of Orlando.
Add in the fact that Darrell Walker refused to play him in his rookie year even though we were terrible, and it’s easy to see why he left.
I was ticked that he left, but because I thought we had a perrenial contender with him and Vince. But I didn’t knock him for leaving; it was in his best interest.
As for adding him this year, I’m a fan of his so I would be for it. However, I don’t see the fit from his perspective. He could get more PT on a better team for money similar to what we should offer him. I don’t think we should overpay him as he doesn’t address our biggest needs (defense and perimeter shooting).
I could see him going to Boston, Dallas, or even LA. All veteran contending teams that could use what he brings to the table.
Look at T-Mac's stats directly after he left the Raptors...
Regardless of what forced him to leave, most people only see how good he was for the next team, and therefore saddle him with the “why didn’t he do that for us” stigma…
"the Truth"
But that’s an unfair reason in my opinion.
-He was drafted out of high school at a time when the league was much older
-He was benched his entire first year and most of his second until Butch Carter took over
-He started to take off in his third year when he got consistent playing time and had matured physically.
-He blew up after he left, yes, but he was given the ball as the lead guy for Orlando, he was the second option here with Vince. Everybody saw the blow-up coming too, as the Raptors themselves were prepared to offer max. money after his 3rd year. It’s just that they low-balled him earlier and ticked him off.
I never said it was rational, just that it is the main reason that a lot of "casual fans" disrespect him...
"the Truth"
I think casual fans “disrespect” him simply because he left. Period. Much the same way everyone was quick to jump on bosh because he left.
Very true. Question: If LeBron doesn’t take his talents to South Beach, is the Chris Bosh hatred this extreme?
Interesting!
Did Bosh get some residual hate splashed on him from LBJ??? Hmmm… possible…
P.S – Remember that TMac was the reason Butch killed his coaching career (he tried to back door Grunwald by promising ownership he could deliver the kid). I love the Raptors they are better than Soaps.
Are you saying threatening to sue an opposing player for slander during a playoff series isn’t a good career move :-)
I read an article years ago in the toronto star where they interviewed Butch… he admitted he did all that stupidness because he actually wanted to get fired… he approached grunwald previously with his letter of resignation in his hand and grunwald didn’t accept it… why he wanted to quit, i don’t know… so butch did the next best thing, did a whole bunch of nonsense and got himself fired
I don’t dislike McGrady for anything he did to the Raptors. I wouldn’t want to touch him with a ten foot pole because he basically wasted what could have been a Hall of Fame career by coasting on his talents rather than working hard and because I never got the feeling he ever really cared all that much about winning. He’s not a good influence on young players, he hasn’t been a good defender in years and it would surprise me a lot if any contender used a roster spot on him.
And people who think he had a good season in Detroit only watched the games he played against Toronto.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
I think you’re being a bit harsh. McGrady was a bit of a victem of circumstance in that he wasn’t surrounded with enough talent in Orlando during the G. Hill injury years and then lived through the Yao injury years in a tough as nails western conferance in Houston. Was he the MOST dedicated guy in the world, no probably not.
I don’t have any first hand knowledge, but everything I’ve read about McGrady says that he pretty much coasted on his talent a la Vince. That was his rap before he was drafted, too. And it’s one reason why I tend to really value guys who are hard workers.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
Yup, I read an interview with McGrady near the end of last season...
He regrets not working harder when he was fit to be a star, and by the time he realized he could be really special if he worked hard… his body wouldn’t cooperate…
He knows he cheated himself out of a legacy…
Sad story, but I’m sure he has a few million reasons to still smile at the end of the day…
"the Truth"
Yes and the key is he realised he made a mistake. Don’t you think that kind of experience could be helpful to someone like say, hmmmmmmm, I don’t know………DD and Barney.
I don't know why you're getting all pissy with me today really...
I like T-Mac, and I gave evidence to show that he isn’t the same immature slacker he once was…
He indeed IS a smart veteran player now…
"the Truth"
I am just saying he is not the complete meathead some believe. YOu said that he knows he cheated himself out of a strong legacy and I was pointing out that he could pass that information on to Derozan and Barney. I was being cheeky about it but the point remains.
So, you reiterate my point by claiming my position is the opposite... makes perfect sense...
"the Truth"
my original response was not actually meant to argue against your point, merely focal the point to my own version of reality in that the Raptors could at least look at the possibility of adding Tmac precisely for his experience and the fact he should not need a long term commitment from the team to come here (if he does then he can go play somewhere else).
I then got defensive when you responded to my response as if it was a personal attack on you when I was really addressing a larger audience of people who think it is not a good idea. My apologise for the misunderstanding.
I love that you are a big enough man to admit there was a misteake and move on rather than draw out the argument just to be defensive...
I also apologize for any misunderstanding on my part.
"the Truth"
Well, DeRozan is already an incredibly hard worker. And if 5 years and countless coaches, fans etc have not been enough to motivate Bargnani, an over-the-hill star with a questionable work ethic certainly isn’t going to do it.
I just literally don’t see any reason to sign a guy like McGrady. None.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
so for like 6 months I've been trying to come up with the name of
the player Demar always reminds me of…. and finally after all that soul searching (and 30 min on google) I got it….. Desmond Mason.
And no…. thats not really a good thing (although not terrible).
Of that list the only 2 guys I’d be interested in are Afflalo and Chandler (and I disagree that Chandler isn’t as good of a defender as Afflalo. He was responsible for 1-4s in NY…. mind you thats NY so I guess it needs to be taken with a grain of salt….) Anything else I’d just say no thanks.
Side note: do people really think AP was a defensive force? Man i thought that guy was a bad defender. Smart player yes, reliable yes, hard worker yes…. but good? Not really. Whenever I think Parker on D I think Jose but with more responsiblility.
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jul 8, 2011 2:44 PM EDT reply actions
I actually thought Eddie Jones was a great parallel for Derozan, moreso than Mason, but I can see that as well (and hoping he’s better than that).
Agreed on Parker’s defense, he was solid, but not spectacular. I think his reputation as a salwart defender around here is more a result of Toronto broadcasters hyperbole than substance.
+1
Kind of like Mo Pete, who was apparently a good defender, yet was the guy who Kobe scored 82 points against. That would have never happened against Battier or Bowen other notable SF defenders of the past 10 years.
Somehow Toronto players that are “not horrible” at defense get a reputation in the local media for being far better at D than the evidence would show.
I think Eddie Jones
is wishful thinking for Derozan. Now I’d love to see him be that type of player but up to this point (although limited sample ofcourse ofcourse and young):
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/2633/career;_ylt=Ai4qGqzx8tXKs7nogXXD56IJPKB4
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3416/career;_ylt=Ai4qGqzx8tXKs7nogXXD56J5PKB4
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4614/career;_ylt=Ai4qGqzx8tXKs7nogXXD56KkvLYF
No range, little D, little ball handling and passing skills….. much more Desmond than Eddie.
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jul 8, 2011 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Parker wasn’t a great defender at the end of his Raptor career and has fallen off even further since then. Horrible option for the Raps in 2011-12.
Geoff Rahal
Author, RaptorsHQ.com
by RaptorsHQ - Defensive Stance on Jul 9, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
re: Parker and backup SG role
In that Raptor wing rotation being smart, reliable and hardworking qualified you to be the primary wing defender. I would contrast him with Calderon in that he had enough strength to guard some SFs. And he was much less injury prone, which ties into being reliable.
It is those aforementioned traits of smart, reliable, and hard worker, plus savvy, which would make Parker a good candidate to backup Demar in my eyes. There are many parts of Parker’s game that DeRozan would do well to emulate. And given his familiarity with Toronto, I think we would be in a good position to sign him on the cheap relative to other teams.
AP
Hold up. While I agree his defence was never stellar, (mostly due to the fact he was giving up so much height in most of his matchups and often covering the Kobe’s of the league) he was a decent defender. Certainly not in the Jose category.
And I agree with nsfs
To me Chandler is the most intriguing guy on the list but I think it would take more than 6 million per to sign him and he will want a long term deal and Afflalo is not far behind. The nice thing about Chandler is that he may actually be a longterm solution for us at the 3. But can we get him without using all the cap room we have left? Is he worth it if he takes all of the room we have left to get him?
I just feel the timing for this type of move is not quite there yet. We are not in a position to make a big push and sign a highly sought after free agent unless it is a perfect fit. While I like both guys, neither is a perfect fit at this time. Maybe in two years we make this type of move, probably not right now. JJ may be much better than most people think. If you watched closely last year, he was very close to be being a huge impact player on both ends of the floor. His shot needs work but he appears to have the tools to be a legitimate starter in this league and one of our biggest holes in the lineup may have already been filled.
Future Lineup
Bayless
DD
JJ
Ed/Amir
JV
None of these players is a proven star in this league or even close…but at least they all have a chance to be. I feel like Jim Carey after the girl tells him the odds of her sleeping with him are less than one in a million…yes. So you’re saying I got a chance? Yes.
It’s better than I felt all last year.
Buddah, I got this one....
Defensive rap, you are now part of the Amir Doubters club, for doubting that Amir is a proven star in this league. Don’t worry, you are not alone. Apparently anyone who doesn’t believe Amir is a superstar power forward who will lead this team to a championship is also in this club. So ya, there’s not a lot of room left in here. ; )
Has Nothing To Be With Being A SuperStar
It is simple.
Underestimating what he can do and will eventually accomplish in the NBA.
Almost everyone here still thinks of him a bench rotation player. That qualifies you automatically for being a member of the Amir Doubters club. It has nothing to do with him becoming a Superstar.
Though I still think that he can be one of the better PFs in the league. You can define what that means. When it happens I will know it.
Amir
So who has more upside Buddah, Ed or Amir?
by defensive rap on Jul 8, 2011 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Amir Vs Ed
I see an epic debate starting here… Buddah, where you at?
Why Buddha doesn't love Ed Davis
We know why he loves Amir, but why not love them both. They are both young and both have big upside.
by defensive rap on Jul 8, 2011 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions
See ya Sonny
Yahoo reporting that Weems has signed with a club in Vilnius. Hope the other Young Gunz give him a nice send off.
And there’s a lot of us Raptors fans here in So. Cal. Buddahfan, let’s hit Staples next season (if/when there is one)
"And there’s a lot of us Raptors fans here in So. Cal. Buddahfan, let’s hit Staples next season..."
That’s awesome! Love seeing Raptors fans in oposing team’s stadiums during Raptors road broadcasts.
1 year in Lithuania with no NBA out clause.
Sonny will be there all next season even if their is peace in the NBA. Deron Williams contract in Turkey lets him return the NBA once the lockout is over.
by Al Bundy is my hero on Jul 9, 2011 7:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Is anybody else stoked that FINALLY the next All Star game WON'T have Yao Ming voted as a starter?
"the Truth"
LOL
I have one word for the NBA All-Star selection committee that is in charge of online All Star voting: firewall.
Personally, I’d prefer picking up one of the younger guys on the SF list, and running a 4-man wing rotation until Kleiza gets back. With DeRozan and Barbosa there, SG is a spot where anyone we pick up simply won’t get minutes. And with Weems still locked down for restricted free agency, when Barbosa is gone, he is a perfectly suitable backup to DD. Just not a need on this team. And there are certainly no good young SG’s that are sure things to be better than DeRozan down the line, so I say stick with it.
We NEED a SF solution, for the very least until Kleiza is done rehabbing... So I agree...
CDR or Reggie Williams are the most logical and feasible answers to our current NEEDS…
In the next draft, it is projected to be FULL of very high calibre SF talent and presumably we can draft a future All Star and have 3 SF’s battling for permanent backup duties and even be able to maintain decent depth at this position going forward…
This means a very deep stable of horses at both Forward positions, good projections on our future at C and SG (depending on DeRozan’s development) and an acquisition or two to be made to round out the rotation with regards to permanent (well, nothing is permanent, but stable) fixtures at the two guard positions…
If we can manage to score a second 1st round pick in the next draft we should be able to pick up a good player for our future PG/SG needs…
"the Truth"
for SF
I think giving JJ a season is worthwhile. He’s not gonna be a star but I can picture him being a good contributor.
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jul 8, 2011 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Right, like I said, Kleiza isn't available until around January, so the signing of a SF is necessary, and has nothing to do with JohnsonJ...
The next draft is supposed to be overflowing with talented SF’s, possibly netting us an All Star… so in that respect, JohnsonJ has a threat to his starting role in a couple years… ample time for him to show himself…
At that time, JohnsonJ, Kleiza and whoever we sign to play in place of rehab Kleiza, will all battle for the backup job… maybe even keeping two of them, giving us the depth I was alluding to…
"the Truth"
re: James Johnson, Jerryd Bayless and incoming competition
At the very least, JJ has got to come into camp in great shape. Even without no significant improvement in his three point shooting range, he can be an energy player off the bench. And given his expected size and strength advantage against bench caliber wings, this would help his contribution as a hustle player.
If the 2012 draft is indeed stacked with SF, JJ needs to show ALOT to be able to lay claim to the position going forward. I don’t see us drafting another project C with our 2012 pick. Same goes for a SG and PF. Assuming equal tier, its either a PG or a SF. Which, ironically, means another player to compete with either Bayless or James Johnson, the rotation players with the shortest track record with the team thus far. Unless they are very disciplined and self-motivated during the lockout, they could be missing a golden opportunity to improve themselves and solidify their spot in the Raptor rotation.
Bayless is acclaimed for his work ethic. However, he is the one that needs game action to polish his PG skills. James Johnson needs more skill development, and to improve his conditioning. In a recent off season interview, BC mentioned that James Johnson was at a lighter weight now then he was during the season. While that says good things about his dedication thus far, exactly what wasn’t he doing during the season. If he needs to really monitor his calorie intake and manage his weight (like Kevin Love) then hopefully he’s getting the help he needs from a personal trainer and part time personal chef.
re second pick
I don’t see us acquiring a second first round pick in the future unless we end up accumulating a stash of additional second round picks and first round picks. Contrary to what I’d like to think, most teams would rather trade picks for future picks, rather then outright for cash.
On the bright side, this past years second round pick (2011) was the last one we traded to Detroit for Delfino. So starting next drat, we have our second round pick as well as our first. If the draft is as draft as it is reputed to be, a high secound rounder could prove to be a significant asset.
Shawn Marion
Is he a star? Not sure really, but he certainly helped win a ring. JJ can contribute in a similar fashion.
JJ could be a very solid NBA starter and could be the starting three on a championship team in 2016. Don’t put a ceiling on him yet. Chicago made a big mistake letting him go because they didn’t have space to develop him within their roster.
It Looks Like The Raptors Will Probably Have One MVP in 2011
I would think Jonas is pretty much a lock for it especially if Lithuania wins the title or probably even if they make it to the finals.
Games 7
MPG 29
PPG 20
RPG 14
BPG 3
His Efficiency Rating is now 30.0 and is about 50% more than the the player with the second highest at 21.7
You’re pimping your site pretty hard there. Don’t want to get the Jeffrey Thompson Special! ;)
by dhackett1565 on Jul 8, 2011 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Wrong Again Smart Butt
Pimps get money for their endeavors.
That website will never earn any money for me.
In addition I do not intend to post anything on it.
I plan to occasionally link it to a Jonas tweet of mine during the 2011-12 season as a “cute” reminder that he will be coming to the NBA. That is all.
You have your head where the son doesn’t shine.
Not a warning but a piece of sound advice. Don’t go around calling people pimps. You don’t have to lower yourself to that level to be heard.
Ha ha ha! Buddah you are so up tight! It was a joke.
by dhackett1565 on Jul 9, 2011 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions
The expression "Does not play well with others" comes to mind...
But likely plays with himself very well…
And Buddha where exactly is my son shining? Does he have a flashlight or is it just his glowing personality that is shining?
Or was he out in the SUN too long…?
"the Truth"
Okay My Apologies
I just don’t think much of pimps and honestly even in a joking way I don’t like someone to be called a pimp if they are not.
Pimps are about the most disgusting form of human being there is.
Anyone who would force by drugs and physical aggression a women or man to sell their bodies for sex is about as low as you can go on the human totem pole outside of murderers.
And to "shamelessly promote something" is commonly referred to as "pimping" it...
So get angry with the whole world population if you really take offense to it…
Or leave your house once a decade and get acclimated with the world around you so the next time someone says “hey player what’s up?” you don’t stab them for insinuating you are a professional athlete when really you’re not…
"the Truth"
You Are Such A Troll
and your definition of Pimp is so out of touch with reality
A pimp is an agent for prostitutes who collects part of their earnings. The pimp may receive this money in return for advertising services, physical protection, or for providing (or in some cases monopolizing) a location where she may engage clients. A woman who runs a brothel is known as a madam rather than a pimp.
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Pimp
As I posted earlier I will be receiving no financial benefit from this website. Its sole purpose is as a teaser and reminder, nothing more.
Get a life will you, please.
You really need help, seriously.
so
are you saying you’d rather be called a madam?
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jul 9, 2011 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
The verb “pimping” came up in the early 17th century.2 In the first years of the 21st century, a new meaning of the word has emerged in the form of a transitive verb pimp, which means “to decorate” or “to gussy up” (compare primp, especially in Scottish usage). This new definition was made popular by Pimp My Ride, an MTV television show.2 Although this new definition paid homage to hip-hop culture and its connection to street culture, it has now entered common, even mainstream commercial, use.
"the Truth"
Also from your own link, which I think describes you perfectly... So I guess you ARE a pimp...
A pimp can also mean “a despicable person”
"the Truth"
You Used The Word As A Verb
Then you find some obscure definition of it as a noun.
The synapses in your brain are crossed and messing with your logic.
Defintion of Pimping or the Verb Form Of Pimp
intr.v. pimped, pimp·ing, pimps
To serve as a procurer of prostitutes.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pimp
So again you are wrong
My Jonas-Valanciunas blog will not be used to procure anything yet alone prostitutes.
+1
I have no issues with either of you, but it would be great if you guys could lay off each other. Nobody wants to read your bickering.
Talkinf fantasy bball on twitter http://twitter.com/FinalsFantasy#
by JumpShootersRUS on Jul 9, 2011 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Ridiculous
and completely pointless.
Much ado about nothing, as the old saying goes…
I am proud to have started this thread of conversation, and yet not really participated in it.
by dhackett1565 on Jul 10, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions
You know for a fan of Budda you seem to be quite easy to rile up. Peace and serenity should be your guide. Ommmmmmmmmm.
I Am Very Much At Peace
as long as my laptop, which I rarely use, doesn’t give me sheet. LOL
My desktops tend to almost always play very nice.
How others feel I have no control over. Everyone owns their own feelings.
He’s having a monster tournament. I’m noticing a lot less talk of him being a soft Euro lately. Coincidence?
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
In Fact There is Very Little If Any Talk About HIm From The ESPN Talking Heads
Of course he played for an American teams especially one of ESPN’s peremnial favorites they would be talking a lot about him right now.
It wasn’t ESPN that called him a soft Euro. It was ignorant Raptor fans, most of whom are very quiet, at the moment.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
I Never Said That ESPN Called Him Soft
I said ESPN was not talking about him but would if he played for an American team
quit making things up!
And I said that there is a lot less talk of him being a soft Euro.
Apparently your comment had nothing to do with mine.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
Which Had Nothing to Do With My Comment Which You Replied To
I was expanding on your original comment and then you responded to mine by making things up about “my post”
Not sure what I made up. I simply thought you were responding to my post by saying that ESPN wasn’t talking about him at all. Didn’t realize you were not.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
This Was Your Original Post
He’s having a monster tournament. I’m noticing a lot less talk of him being a soft Euro lately. Coincidence?
My response was
In Fact There is Very Little If Any Talk About HIm From The ESPN Talking Heads Of course he played for an American teams especially one of ESPN’s peremnial favorites they would be talking a lot about him right now.
My initial response to your post had nothing to do with your comment about “Soft Euros”
My response was just pointing out that ESPN is not talking about him so much because Jonas was not drafted by an American team.
Then you responded mentioning soft again in a manner that indicated I was even talking about the Soft issue which I was not. I never associated ESPN with J.V. being soft. That was your thing.
It wasn’t ESPN that called him a soft Euro. It was ignorant Raptor fans, most of whom are very quiet, at the moment.
That I when I said quit making things up. What you made up was to imply that I was talking about ESPN calling him soft. I never went there and still haven’t gone there. I have no idea of whether or not they did mention that JV was Soft. Totally irrelevant to my response about your OP.
Loved the Valanciunas pick on Draft night. Loving it even more now. It certainly seems like the right move so far, given that I think a lot of the players selected before and after Valanciunas are going to have rather underwhelming careers.
Geoff Rahal
Author, RaptorsHQ.com
by RaptorsHQ - Defensive Stance on Jul 9, 2011 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Ya, I’m kind of loving the fact that the pick is looking better and better. You were one of the few Raptor writers who didn’t seem to have to be “convinced” the pick was a good one. I don’t know which I was more happy about. That it was Valanciunas or that it wasn’t Brandon Knight.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
As Long As It Wasn't Walker or Vesely
I would have been okay with the pick
Of course it turned out to be the player I have wanted the Raptors to take since May, other than maybe Kanter.
Williams would have also been a very good pick but drafting him would not have helped end the Bargnani era. LOL
Irving was never a realistic possibility.
Valanciunas update
Lithuania 53 Russia 26 at the half, Jonas 15 pts and 9 rebounds.
Lithuania in Final
Valanciunas just an average day with 21points and 13 rebounds in a laugher 85-68 over their former hated comrades, after destroying them in the first half by 27.
Actually Many Lithuanians Fought On The Side Of The Nazis in WWII
Lithuania may have been annexed by Russia at one time but I doubt that the majority of Lithuanians ever supported that.
Jonas Interview After Victory Over Russians
1. Want to thank my teammates for playing so hard
2. Want to thank the fans for supporting us. They were are our sixth man
3. I expect a full house for tomorrows game.
Jonas FIBA U19 Rankings
PPG 1st
RPG 1st
BPG 1st
FG% 2nd
FT% 3rd
2nd in FG%??
What is he, some soft, jumpshooting Euro?
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
dont really like the names of these guys.
Dont know who we would go with but lets see what happens i guess.
Jonas Brother
Don’t think this worked first time around -
You're comparing Valanciunas to Michael Bradley???
Are you kidding? Is it because they’re both tall and white?
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
Bradley-Jonas
Put them side to side. Definitely could pass as family.
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