Brandon Knight vs. Kemba Walker - Who Should the Raptors Draft?
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 9:30 AM EDT
in NBA Draft
Email
Print
Two point guards. Both top prospects, both with major potential and major questions as to how successful they'll be in the NBA. The HQ compares Brandon Knight and Kemba Walker, ultimately making a decision on which one they'd prefer to see in a Raptors' uniform.
Let's rewind to the infamous NBA Draft of 2004.
Oh yes, the "Hoffa Draft."
At the time, the Raptors desperately needed a point guard, and the hope was that Toronto could somehow nab one of the top options in that class.
How desperate were they for help at the 1?
Well...the following point guards were on the roster of the Raptors the prior year:
-Dion Glover
-Roger Mason Jr.
-Rod Strickland
-Alvin Williams
-Me
And we think the Jose Calderon/Jerryd Bayless situation is rough!
So off go the Raps, looking to hook a big fish via the draft.
Only problem that year was that by the time the draft rolled around, it didn't seem like any of the top options would still be available when Toronto picked at 8. As a refresher, those top options were UCONN stud Ben Gordon, fresh off an NCAA title, high school star Shawn Livingston, and Wisconsin floor general Devin Harris.
Gordon and Livingston were predicted to go in the first few picks, but the hope was that Harris would fall into Toronto's lap, or a trade would take place enabling the Dinos to nab Gordon or Livingston.
Neither of these scenarios occured.
Instead, all three went in the first five picks, Harris to the Washington Wizards in a trade with the Dallas Mavericks.
Toronto was stuck on the outside looking in, and when other top wing options like Luol Deng and Josh Childress were taken, the club took Rafael Araujo.
Was it panic?
Desperation?
Who knows, but the bottom line was that Omar Cook and Rafer Alston got auditions at the 1 the next year, because of the Raps' inability to secure one of the aforementioned three prospects. (Ironically, any of the point guards who went later in the draft, Jameer Nelson, Beno Udrih, even Chris Duhon, would have been better options than Hof.)
The interesting thing is that the Ben Gordon/Devin Harris debate of that year was quite similar to the one currently in progress regarding the NBA future of Kemba Walker versus Brandon Knight. Gordon was the known commodity, but viewed as more of a combo-guard and scorer than pure point, and Harris, not a pure point either, was viewed by many as perhaps being the better long-term option for a team thanks to his superior upside.
In this year's draft, Kemba, like his alma mater compatriot Gordon, is the more proven player while Knight, like Harris, has the greater upside.
So which one should the Raptors take if both are indeed available with the fifth pick?
That's the million dollar question right now, as Raptors' fans seem to be pretty divided on which direction to head.
This morning then I thought we'd take an in-depth look at both players from every conceivable angle, starting with their physical attributes.
Measurements:
Kemba measured out at 6 foot 1 in shoes, with a 6-3 and a half wingspan, and nearly a 7-8 standing reach to go with 8 inch hands.
Brandon topped those marks, standing a shade over 6-3 with nearly a 6-7 wingspan and 8-2 standing reach to go with 9 and a half inch hands.
Brandon was slightly lighter than Kemba despite being taller, (178 versus 184 pounds), and while both had ridiculously good body fat measures, Brandon's was a bit lower (4% versus 5.9%.)
Finally, while Walker tested out as the higher leaper of the two (nearly a 40 inch max vertical versus just under 38 for Brandon), Knight was stronger (10 reps on the bench versus 7 for Kemba), quicker in the lane agility drills, and faster in the full court sprint.
Now there really wasn't a ton of difference in the last three marks, but overall Knight gets the nod here in the "measurements" category. Sure, we see top athletes fail to become even decent basketball players in every draft, but if I'm a GM I feel better about drafting someone who at least physically appears to have an advantage on the court, especially given the concerns about Knight's "point guard abilities." These marks indicate that if he puts in the effort, he should at least be able to hold his own on the defensive end, moreso arguably than Walker.
Advantage - Knight.
Note - Of the guards in Knight's "size-range" listed in Draftexpress' database, the most similar in terms of the metrics described above include Randy Foye, Armon Johnson, Igor Rakocevic, Russell Westbrook and Jerryd Bayless.
Resume:
This one goes to Kemba pretty easily.
As Jonathan Givony of Draftexpress noted yesterday, we're talking about a player who came to UCONN in a fairly unheralded manner, who couldn't shoot at all, nor run a team. I can vividly recall his sophomore season where he looked like a major liability at the 1, turning the ball over on average nearly 3 times a game, and aside from having great speed and explosiveness, simply not appearing to be an NBA caliber guard.
That changed last year when he carried his club to not only an NCAA tourney berth, but all the way to the title.
Knight too had a very positive impact on his club, taking them deep in the tournament and as a freshman, but he was surrounded with superior talent, and his Wildcats didn't go through the maniacal winning stretch that Kemba's Huskies did, winning the Big East Tourney.
On the season Kemba averaged 23.5 points per game, 4.5 assists, 4.1 rebounds and 1.9 steals to go with 2.3 turnovers in just under 38 minutes a game.
Knight averaged 17 points per game, 4.2 assists, 4 rebounds and 0.7 steals to go with 3.2 turnovers in a shade under 36 minutes a game.
Knight shot the ball better from long range, 38% versus 33% for Walker, but for someone touted as a much more lethal shooter than Kemba, the Kentucky product actually had a slightly worse percentage from the field last year, 42.3% versus Walker's 42.8%.
Walker did take almost five more shots a game than Knight on average, but again, with players like Terrence Jones beside him, Brandon simply didn't need to score the ball nearly as much as Kemba.
And I don't want to hear this "Kemba can't shoot" line of thought any more.
Is he Ray Allen?
No.
But this is a player who worked tirelessly on improving his shot and there's no reason to think he won't do the same thing at the next level.
Factor in Kemba's regular season and tourney awards, and three years of proven success at UCONN in one of the country's toughest divisions, and Walker gets the nod.
Advantage - Walker
Advanced Statistics:
This is where things get very interesting.
While the knock on Kemba has always been that he's too much of a scoring guard, and not enough of an actual point guard, the advanced metrics that have recently come to light, don't bear that out.
As John Hollinger noted in his annual pre-draft post yesterday:
If I had to peg two other perimeter players that I would guarantee to at least become solid rotation players, it would be Kemba Walker and Kawhi Leonard. While this year's draft doesn't project to have a lot of star talent at the perimeter positions, Walker and Leonard are the two who rate above 12 -- which, historically, has been a guarantee of at least being decent.
The "12" that Hollinger is referring to is derived from his "Draft Rater," "a regression analysis comparing 16 variables to a player's NBA player efficiency rating, using the average of their top three seasons in their first seven years as a pro."
Walker's mark of 12.75 on Hollinger's scale puts him in a similar class as past point guards like Chris Paul, Jordan Farmar, T.J. Ford, Russell Westbrook, Mike Conley, Jameer Nelson, Ty Lawson, Ray Felton and Darren Collison.
Knight on the other hand only scored a 10.02, barely over the "10" mark that has traditionally been on the lower side of Hollinger's grading for point guards. Hollinger notes that only Rajon Rondo and Kyle Lowry have scored similar marks in the past, and have gone on to good to great careers.
The other names with a similar mark?
Combo-guard central, including D.J. Augustin, Mario Chalmers, and our buddies Marcus Banks and Jerryd Bayless.
I will say there are two big caveats for me regarding Hollinger's mark though for Knight.
First, one-and-done players typically don't fare as well in Hollinger's system (Russell Westbrook is a great example of this), and if you look at Knight's marks after the first 10 games or so of the season, when Kentucky coach John Calipari changed the team's offense to better fit Brandon's style, I think you'd see Knight's advanced stats jump out a lot more.
Remember, Rajon Rondo looked dreadful in terms of his advanced stats after his final year at Kentucky, but coach Tubby Smith had him playing as an off-guard by the time the season ended. Sometimes a college system just isn't as conducive as an NBA one to certain player's levels of success.
However even with these caveats, looking at further advanced metrics, Kemba still comes out on top.
In Dean Oliver's recent work on the subject for ESPN.com, Walker had a much better "pure-point-rating," an attempt to measure "how a particular player will fare as a distributor in the NBA," than Knight did.
From the article:
Walker had a 1.5 PPR in college. It also took him only 18 minutes per game to get a steal or block and he was able to score inside. His upside is the same or slightly better than Knight's, but he is definitely a safer pick -- his chance of failing is less than one out of 10. There are no red flags on Walker, making him a one-out-of-three shot of becoming a good player at the next level.
Knight, meanwhile, has a one-in-four chance of being good, but the numbers suggest that his chances of success ride heavily on his shooting ability, not his passing. Knight had a minus-1.4 PPR in college, which is extremely low for a point guard -- lower, in fact, than any NBA starting point guard's college PPR except for Stephen Curry, who did not play point guard until his third and final year at Davidson.
Oliver goes on to say that:
In short, studies show that point guards with his characteristics don't live up to first-round expectations.
Yikes.
And looking at other marks like True Shooting Percentage, Usage, and PER, Walker is at worst on par, if not much further ahead than Knight in these marks.
Draftexpress' recent breakdown on the point guard class goes a step further and shows that Knight also struggles in two key areas that tend to be good indicators of NBA success; running the pick-and-roll, and getting to the free-throw line.
He participated in the third lowest percentage of pick-and-rolls (14.3% of the time) amongst this class' guards, didn't attack the basket at a high rate, taking shots around the basket on just 20% of his halfcourt possessions, third lowest of the group, and had one of the lower free-throw drawing percentages (10.0%).
I'd argue these points are of particular concern for Raptors' fans considering how important the pick-and-roll is in the NBA, and how much the team needs someone who can create off the bounce.
Knight's isolation stats are excellent however, which may negate some of these issues, but if you're looking at someone who can come in and play the 1 right away, advanced stats definitely point to Kemba Walker.
Finally, a look at the Win Scores of this year's class has Kemba out ahead of Knight again.
The average position adjusted win score (PAWS) for a player is 7.1 and while Kemba easily tops that with a mark of 10.6, Knight falls below the average, with a PAWS of only 6.3. Remember, PAWS takes into account the defensive end of the court too so this is not simply a measure of offensive effectiveness.
In summary, there isn't an advanced statistical view of these two players that prefers Brandon Knight to Kemba Walker and therefore...
Advantage: Walker
Intangibles:
I left one more section here before putting a bow on this analysis, a section I'd like to call intangibles.
Because while Kemba up to this point looks to be the better choice for the Raptors at five, I believe there are a few other considerations.
For one, Knight is the younger of the two, 19 versus 21, and at face value therefore has perhaps another level or two to his game that Walker does not. (Hell, Knight may still be growing!)
Second, while Kemba is definitely a mature player, driven, and a leader on the court, Knight simply has this demeanor that I'd describe as Kobe Bryant-esque. He doesn't possess Kemba's media flair, but I'm not sure that's a bad thing considering the Dinos' needs.
He's also an extremely intelligent kid, we're talking about a player who sported a 4.28 GPA in a private school known for academics.
When I factor these points in, as well as the potential size issues that Kemba may face on the defensive end when he's posted up one-on-one, Knight gets the very slim nod in this category.
Advantage: Knight
Verdict:
I think Tim Chisholm said it best in regards to these two players, in his recent post:
Everything with Walker comes down to the things he can't do, whereas everything about Knight is about the things that he'll learn to do.
Bingo.
It's a bit of a "which would you rather" situation; the player who could be a star, or the player everyone knows will be good, maybe really good, but without the same upside?
Aaah the lure of potential.
So with the score in the above categories knotted at two, which way am I leaning?
Admittedly, still towards Knight.
However not by much, and we'll be updating our draft board this afternoon to reflect this.
The simple fact is that I'm not over the moon about either player and while I'd slightly prefer Knight to Walker, if Knight's gone and Walker's the pick at 5, so be it.
For me the reality is that regardless of who Toronto picks at five, I'm not convinced enough that they'll be a major factor in the team's improvement next season, assuming there is a season, so I'm more intrigued by the impact of the new coach, who will be announced this afternoon in a 1 PM presser, and any additional draft and free agent moves.
Mark me down for one dose of Brandon Knight...
...but if that's not on the menu, I'll gladly take a heaping of Kemba Walker.
235 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
great question which guard?
All things being equal or not so equal !!!! all polls indicate that Knight will be gone and nor Kemba ?….what are they seeing that Kemba watchers dont see ?
I think it’s the intangibles part.
Teams just don’t learn from the past and every year, gamble on upside versus sure thing.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Is PG really the greatest need?
I’m not convinced that PG is our greatest need right now. I’m more comfortable with Calderon/Bayless than I am with Bargs/Ajinca or J.Johnson/Weems/Kleiza.
That’s another topic altogether and a very valid point.
In fact one could argue that with the Knight/Walker situation being what it is, the BEST play might be to go in an entirely different direction altogether.
Valanciunas, a legit center, would probably the best bet then but this buy-out situation is certainly clouding things.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
I really don’t see the buyout as a reason to pass on Valanciunas. In fact, it could even be an advantage. He will come over with more experience and be closer to physical maturity. Plus, he can spend the year with an English tutor and the Raptors can send coaches and trainers over to informally monitor his progress.
Next season the Raptors coaches will have enough on their plate with the development of young players such as DeMar, Ed, Alabi, Bayless, JJ and even Amir. When those guys have had a year to get the knack of Casey’s systems then the Raptors will have Valanciunas and next year’s rookie waiting in the wings.
An additional bonus, is that with a lockout looming you know that Valanciunas will be playing next year even if the league goes for the nuclear option and blows up the whole season.
+1
Well put – I agree with you but less eloquently.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions
I think the buyout is more of a reason to pass on Valanciunas for Colangelo due to his own contract situation. Which is probably why the Raptors will go in another direction. Not that this would be the best thing for the franchise, but BC tends to do what’s good for BC and BC’s ego before doing what’s best for the franchise.
I think I disagree. You can question his judgment, as it has been flawed at times, but I’ve always gotten the impression that BC is a true professional.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Right, which is why its taken 5 years for him to come clean on Bargnani, when everyone else figured it out 3 years ago,…
Like I said – question his judgment all you like.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Like I said, maybe it has as much to do with self preservation as judgement . As in “if I just give Bargnani more minutes and more time and more shotes, he’ll improve, which will save my reputation”. Also funny how you were a supporter of re-signing Colangelo and defended his judgement on numerous occasions, yet now concede he has bad judgement. I guess you do as well…
What? I’ve condemned his judgment in specific cases quite clearly, especially the Hedo signing. Others I have been ambivalent about – for example, not trading Bargnani, as I expect that has as much to do with what was offered back rather than his own personal agenda. I’ve supported his abilities more than his judgment – his trades especially, but I’ve been quite clear in my criticism of a good number of his free agency decisions. Anyway, this has little to do with my belief in his judgment – I simply said that just because you disagree with his moves doesn’t necessarily mean there has to be a conspiracy theory or selfish motivation behind it.
Like I said, maybe it has as much to do with self preservation as judgement.
Like you said, maybe it does. And like I said, I don’t believe that, because he seems like a professional to me.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions
“…for example, not trading Bargnani, as I expect that has as much to do with what was offered back rather than his own personal agenda.”
Sorry, can’t agree. BC has gone on record – in order to justify both his selection of Bargnani and his contract extension – saying that he recieves offers for Bargnani all the time, that he is such a valued commodity. If so, why hasn’t he been traded? Because BC’s ego can’t allow him to. He needs to be “right” on Bargnani to vindicate himself. Otherewise he would have jumped at one of those offers as any layman that would look at Bargnani related data can tell you he’s terrible. So its not a matter of judgement in this instance unless you believe his judgement to be so flawed that he can look at the mointaine of evidence regarding Bargnani and get that equation completely wrong. That would be bad judgement on a historical level for a man that is supposed to be a basketball executive and ergo an “expert”. BC can’t be THAT stupid, can he?
You believe something BC tells the media? The guy who is known most for his spin? Well, OK, to each his own.
I take absolutely NOTHING from BC saying he’s had offers for Bargnani.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Ok so let me make sure I have this straight… BC wasn’t getting multiple offers for Bargnani, he made that up. Yet, despite the lack of interest, he chose to pre-emptively extend Bargnani’s contrat, a year before he had to, at a much higher rate than would have been his market value. Hmm… This is worldclass bad decision making. Or maybe, just maybe there is a nuance here. Maybe, the tie to Bargnani is not entirely rational. In fact it would have to be or BC is an absolute fool. So if the tie is irational, his decisions would have to be clouded by self-preservation and/or a desire for vindication.
So again, it comes down to him being a worldclass imbicile or the possibility that his judgement is somewhat clouded when it comes to his reputation. I myself believe its a bit of both actually. To argue that BC has no motivation to protect his career and reputation is absurd.
Or to easily deflate that argument – perhaps he got lots of offers when Bargnani was on his rookie contract, but hasn’t gotten decent offers since his extension? The world is not so black and white as you believe it – I believe BC can make flawed judgment calls sometimes (as do we all) without sacrificing the team to save his own reputation.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 22, 2011 8:17 AM EDT up reply actions
Disagree with drafting for need
I say they draft the best player, no matter what position. If you end up with a surplus at a position, you can always trade one of the surplus players later.
Really, it’s only at PF that the Raptors have any real depth anyway. If you draft a PF, I think it would be really easy to find a taker for Amir or Davis or the newly drafted PF if you needed to move one later.
Agreed
The only position one could possibly make an argument that they have decent talent is PF. Any other position could do with an upgrade. That is why the Raptors are the perfect example of a team that should draft best on best player available.
I think I disagree. You can question his judgment, as it has been flawed at times, but I’ve always gotten the impression that BC is a true professional.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Oops – this was meant to be a reply to your comment above.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions
But....
if we drafted the best player and that is another power forward aside from AB who are you willing to give up. We will now have AB(?), Davis, Amir, New PF. If that is the case doesn’ it lower the value of these PF as other teams will know the raps are desperate into getting rid of at least one of them? For worst case scenario let’s say AB was not traded.
great analysis
Thoughtful and thorough analysis. In this draft I dont’ think you can go wrong with selecting either one. This is a draft where the #1 pick is not projected to be an all-star by most observers,or at least it’s debatable, and there is a player who hasn’t played competitive ball in 2 years and is under 6’10 that many are calling a top #3 pick projected to be a 5 in the league??!!
Play it safe and take a proven player (Walker) who will contribute and is arguably is as good or better than your current compliment of guards (Bayless has NO court vision, and Jose jumper is gone) or take Knight and let him develop his game. There’s a lot worse options out there than taking a Calipari guard in the draft.
by stretch bigman on Jun 21, 2011 10:01 AM EDT reply actions
Completely agree.
I think the focus should be adding to the current core and that goes well beyond this fifth pick. If the Raps can grab a second first-rounder…done. Then, move onto free agency.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
I’ve gotta say neither of these guys are an exciting option with the 5th pick. Walker seems to be the safer play, but Knight potentially has more upside IF you assume the advanced metrics are treating Knight in a similar fashion to a guy like Rondo. Based solely on advanced stats, Knight seems like a waste of a pick (destined to be that combo guard/3rd guard off the bench).
And yes, to benjibopper’s point above, point guard and power forward are not the positions of need right now. Centre, small forward and even shooting guard are holes.
Geoff Rahal
Author, RaptorsHQ.com
by RaptorsHQ - Defensive Stance on Jun 21, 2011 10:03 AM EDT reply actions
Yeah… at this point, this article just makes me feel worse about Knight. A little better about Walker, but not enough to want him at 5. And, really, even Knight has been a few spots below the top of my draft board pretty much the whole time.
I just don’t see either being a huge impact player, so why draft a PG when there are so many promising bigs available? Or even a SF like Leonard?
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I strongly disagree with your statement of so many promising bigs when no one has seen enes play since the Nike Hoops summit a couple years ago, bismack is a project pick and Jonas Valanciunas sounds like a darko milicic, that hardly sounds promising to me.
I do agree with your assesement of Kawhi , he sounds like a gerald wallace to meet but what the raptors need the most right now is a pg who can defend and can penetrate, also next years draft is loaded with SF’s
its interesting
I’ve been watching nba tv the last few days as they were doing their draft shows on some of the players and they were pretty much saying kemba will be the better point guard in this whole draft. Even more so than irving..I wouldn’t mind who the raps draft as long as its one of these 2.
by sherwin316 on Jun 21, 2011 10:04 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Excellent article
Great article Adam! I swear this draft has me so schizophrenic these days. I read one article and wanna draft this guy, and i read another and wanna draft that guy. I cant make up my mind. I feel like whoever we end up drafting could be a good player, whether it be Knight, Walker or someone else. But I also feel like that player could be a huge bust and some guy drafted 22 overall will be a stud. Players from 1-30 in this draft have the potential to go either way in this draft imo. The question is: will we get a solid player or a bust.
Super schizo!
I guess the good thing is that I’ve started to move past this fifth pick and basically now hope to see some more action that night that improves the team.
Whoever they take at 5 is just going to be another cog in the rebuild, but doubtful that it turns out to be a cornerstone.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Good summary
Seems like the arguments boil down to the following:
- Walker has a better resume (especially advanced stats)
- Knight has better “perceived” potential (younger and bigger)
In the intangibles, if you are going to give Knight credit for intelligence then you have to give Walker credit for confidence and tenacity.
Walker's upside
If the Raptors end up picking Walker then I hope that the Jameer Nelson is the guy that he ends up resembling as his NBA career unfolds.
Kleiza: ‘It would be great to play in Lithuania if there’s a lockout’
The Toronto Raptors forward Linas Kleiza was sidelined for the second part of last season and will also have to miss the EuroBasket 2011 in Lithuania. The 26-year-old player is already thinking about the future, but makes it clear that making a full recovery is on top of his priority list.
"Right now the most important thing for me is to get my leg in order. If the lockout lasts out for a while, it would be great to come back to Lithuania and play a part of the season here," Linas Kleiza said in an online conference at Delfi.lt.
The statement sparked talks about which team the Lithuanian superstar would choose – Zalgiris or Lietuvos Rytas. Kleiza was open about his views on the topic.
"When both teams play in Euroleague, I equally support them both. However, I was born and grew up in Kaunas and Zalgiris has always been my favorite team," said Kleiza admitted.
I'm also still leaning towards Knight
Great article Adam. One criticism, though. Stop asking yourself questions and then answering them. ; )
Ha ha ha ha ha ha.
BAD habit of mine in my writing, you’re right – gotta keep an eye on that. This article was so long that after three hours of writing and analysis, kinda lost track of the Q and A’s.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Do I notice you do that? Yes, I do. Does it annoy me? Not really. Do I sometimes do it myself? Absolutely.
Tim W.
The Picket Fence
You know who does this the best?
Hubbie Brown. He actually talks in the FOURTH person! LOL
Example: “You say to your self, is he a good defensive player? You answer yes, he is. But you ask yourself, could he rebound better?”
LOL
He’s my favorite Coulour Broadcaster by the way…
It sounds like
Brown not only asks and answers his own questions, but he does it for other people as well. LOL!!!
Nevermind
I just said exactly what you did. Duh!!!
There you go Adam, there is my fault, skimming through posts. ; )
From Doug Smith
Interestingly, Smith is saying that Kemba isn’t even a top option for the Raps:
With so much indecision above them in the draft — Cleveland has the first and fourth picks sandwiched around Minnesota at No. 2 and Utah at No. 3 — it’s been impossible for the Raptors to get a firm grasp on who might be available at their choice.
They have, (The Raptors) according to league sources, made efforts to move up to No. 2 but don’t have a good match with Minnesota and have narrowed their list of draft hopefuls to about four.
That group would include Kentucky guard Brandon Knight, Lithuanian centre Jonas Valanciunas, San Diego State swingman Kawhi Leonard and Biyombo with Vesely and Connecticut guard Kemba Walker as fallback possibilities.
The Valanciunas part is especially strange considering that yesterday it was reported that his buy-out situation would potentially keep him in Europe for another year.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
The Valanciunas part is especially strange considering that yesterday it was reported that his buy-out situation would potentially keep him in Europe for another year.
Would that be that bad a thing? Especially if he’s picked with a second top-10 pick (come on BC, this is a good draft to get a second high pick in – decent talent, but not good enough that the price will be extraordinary).
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Long term it definitely wouldn’t. Another year in the 20 win range, another top pick in a much better draft (assuming there’s a season, etc, etc) and then a huge jump in the W column the following year when Valanciunas comes over.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions
No player in this year’s draft is going to prevent another 20-something-win season for the Raptors, so it really doesn’t matter, in the short term, if Valanciunas comes in this year or next.
I want the Raptors to get the best player available and if Valanciunas is that guy then I want them to take him regardless of the buyout.
Posted this above...
But it comes down to BC doing something that is good for the team that may not be good for him (due to short contract). So don’t hold your breath for Jonas.
Solid point
As I said before, BC is in self preservation mode right now and may not be doing what is best for the team in the long run. We can only hope that he has a five year plan to turn this franchise around with the full support of management, but given the 2 year contract extension, that probably isn’t the case.
I don't quite agree with you MAS
The Raptors could easily get worse by giving significant minutes to whoever they draft with the #5 pick. That player will be a rookie trying to find his way in the NBA. A guy like Leonard should be a very good player after a couple of seasons, but on his way to getting there he will probably commit lots of fouls, get blown by plenty, turn the ball over, brick a lot of 3s and generally go through rookie growing pains.
If the Raptors want to have a better chance at winning next season, along the lines of your BC self-preservation thesis, then they may be better off not having a rookie in the line-up.
When the core guys like Ed, DeMar, Amir, maybe Bayless and whoever they get for Andrea have a year under their belts playing for Casey then the team may be in a better position to integrate one or more rookies.
In conclusion, I don’t totally disagree with your point, but I also don’t agree with it because I think an opposite argument could be made that is just as valid as yours.
Fair enough
My thoughts on that are that the team’s record is not goint to be impacted to a significant extent by whoever they select. Its not as though had Jonas not had a buyout and he played next year, he would improve the Raps record by 10 wins. However, BC would understand that if he can demonstrate that he is putting together a solid young core, and they are developing under the newly hired coach, he will have a stronger case for redemption. However, he can’t DEMONSTRATE this to the same extent if his top pick for 2011 is languishing in the Euroleagues. Out of sight, out of mind…
Emphasis on defense
True, but BC can spend this season promoting his new commitment to defense and selling the hiring of Coach Casey.
Also, if Colangelo can move Bargnani before next season then he can sell whoever he gets back in return.
The other half being signing the extension?
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep – don’t think we’re going to go. Should be a pretty run-of-the-mill affair.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
For those who don’t know – that’s 1:00 PM EDT.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Colangelo re Casey ??
Presser will be streamed live on Raptors.com @ 1:00 PM EDT
Countries Should Drop This Local Time Garbage and Go to GMT
With the world now having become a global economy and with the Net it makes absolutely no sense to stay with these local time conventions.
Kids in Toronto would love it. They could sleep in until 11 AM in the summers and Noon during most of the school year and still get to class on time. LOL
Nah. Casey’s going to announce that the Raps had traded Bargnani, who they’ll pick with their draft pick, and that there will be no lockout next year. Shame you guys won’t be there ;)
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Current Top Five Pcks
1. Irving
2. Williams
3. Kanter
4. Valanciunas
5. Knight
Barbosa and/or Calderon will become be history
Brandon Knight
Full Name: Brandon Knight
Position: Guard
Height/Weight: 6-3 / 185
Birthdate: December 2, 1992
College: Kentucky
Strengths:
* Intelligent
* Good shooter
* Got better as year progressed at running his team
* Athletic
Weaknesses:
* Needs to get bigger and stronger
* Needs to develop mid-range game
* Continue to emphasize facilitating for teammates
NBA projection:
Lottery pick. Just as former John Calipari point guards Derrick Rose, Tyreke Evans and John Wall before him, Knight used his freshman season in college to continually evolve as a point guard. He’ll continue to get better and better in the NBA and add the dimension of consistent deep shooting that his predecessors didn’t have.
2010-11 Season:
Knight was a first-team freshman All-America pick by the United States Basketball Writers Association and a first-team All-SEC selection. He won six SEC Freshman of the Week awards, tying the record set by Alabama’s James “Hollywood” Robinson. He finished fourth in the league in scoring, second in assists, first in minutes played and fifth in three-pointers per game (2.3).
Key statistics:
17.3 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 4.1 apg, 3.1 tpg, 0.6 spg, 35.9 mpg, .423 FG, .377 3PT, .795 FT
Cool statistic:
Knight broke the Kentucky freshman scoring record for points in a season (657) that had been only a year old. John Wall scored 616 points a year ago. Knight also knocked down a Kentucky freshman record 87 three-pointers.
What Insiders Say:
Kentucky coach John Calipari
“I told him that his curve is probably sharper than even Derrick’s or Tyreke’s or John’s. Where he was at the beginning of the year and where he is now, it’s been a—you’re talking about a freshman, 18-year-old guard, leading his team, playing just about every minute that he can stand on that basketball court. And we’re one of the five teams in the country with the least amount of turnovers. And so that alone, he’s running the club, he’s still scoring, we need him to score points, he’s kind of going through what Tyreke and John Wall went through. Those two in high school took a lot of shots, just like Brandon, and had to figure out how I do this within this team. Derrick was a little different. We had to get him to shoot. But I’m really pleased, really pleased.”
What Outsiders Say:
Former Tennessee coach Bruce Pearl
“Brandon Knight’s a better shooter [than John Wall]. They both have got great length as point guards. John Wall might be the fastest guard from end to end to ever play the game. That’s one facet of being a point guard is his explosiveness and speed. He’s just a rare athlete like that. But Brandon Knight’s got length, he’s got every bit the feel, he’s a better shooter. He’s a good defender. I just think they’re comparable with the exception of Wall’s rare athleticism and explosiveness and speed with the ball.”
Ohio State coach Thad Matta
“I’m very impressed with his ability to run their team. He’s got the ability to not only score, but he makes players better around him. For his size as a point guard he is long, he is athletic, and he showed in the Princeton game things … he didn’t shoot the ball particularly well in that game but he makes the game-winner. With as young as they are, I think he has done a tremendous job of coming in and learning the system that they are trying to play. He is a heck of a player. He is a challenge to guard.”
Georgia coach Mark Fox
“I think he’s a better player in the half court than John Wall was. He shoots the ball better. He goes by you on the dribble. He’s got a super mind for the game. He makes passes that makes players better.”
Bargnani for #4?
Is this year’s draft bad enough that Bargnani could net a top ten or even top five pick? Cleveland has a nice fat TPE hanging around. Would they take Bargnani in exchange for the #4 pick. He would start producing for them a lot sooner than either Valanciunas or Kanter. Bargnani-Varajeo might be able to work for them???
I guess this is not a particularly serious proposal, but hopefully Colangelo is working on potential Bargnani trades at the draft.
Bargnani-Varajeo might work... a telling look at the raptors roster over the past few years
I find that to be an intersting comment, and infact I agree with that assessment. It also goes to show why Andrea hasn’t been better in his time in Toronto. Varajeo is the ideal player that loves to hang around the basket and be a pest, and he is very good at it too. He is a big player that can defend the 4 or 5 well and doesn’t need a lot of touches on offence to be productive. Varajeo isn’t a dominate back to the basket player, but he does demand the defence to be accountable to him.
Compairing that to what the Raptors have and have had, Varajeo is the kind of player I would love to see on this team. Neither Bosh, Amir, Davis, Rasho, Jermaine O’Neal, or Bargnani like to do the dirty work around the basket. Reggie Evans doesn’t mind getting in the mix, but to be honest he just doesn’t have the offensive skills to be effective. The only player that comes to mind over the past few seasons as being capable of being the garbage man around the hoop was Kris Humphries. The only problem with Hump was that after he scored a basket or two he thought he was superman and started to play outside of his skill set.
by Al Bundy is my hero on Jun 21, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Cleveland Trade
To Cleveland: Bargnani + 5th Pick
To Raptors: #4 Pick + TPE
Bargs alongside Hickson / Varejao?
Raptors draft Kanter…
Cleveland drafts JV…bring him over in a year…
“the Truth”
by Mikthaniel on Jun 20, 2011
"the Truth"
Now is not the time to trade for TPE with the unknown CBA just around the corner.
by Al Bundy is my hero on Jun 21, 2011 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly right – now is the perfect time to a) create TPE’s by effectively trading for them, freeing up capspace and b) NOT use up our own TPE.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
My point is I would rather see an assest turned into a present asset not a future assest. Under the current CBA a team that has a TPE available can take back salary in a trade, no one knows what the new CBA will look like come July or whenever it gets settled. It’s possible that TPE could be elimanted. If Andrea gets traded I would like to see it for another player and not a trade exception.
by Al Bundy is my hero on Jun 21, 2011 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions
They wouldn't be able to snatch back a current TPE, would only prohibit their future creations... IF they were eliminated...
Current TPE’s would have to be grandfathered…
"the Truth"
Maybe... or maybe not, and if they are compensated at what value?
by Al Bundy is my hero on Jun 21, 2011 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Actually, the elimination of the TPE’s would almost be a positive thing. Such an elimination would only happen in a hard cap situation – making cap room the most precious of commodities. And making a trade into a TPE rather than using your own actually creates cap space. So either a) a hard cap is not implemented, and the team has two large TPEs to use or b) a hard cap is implemented and the team has cap room to absorb contracts and therefore assets from other teams.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I would be all for the elimination of TPE and implementing a Hard Cap.
by Al Bundy is my hero on Jun 21, 2011 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions
If that happens, do you want the Raps bogged down in contracts? Because that is what you were suggesting they make happen above. Cap space could be infinitely more valuable to teams trapped in a hard cap scenario than whatever we could get back straight up for Bargnani now.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Trade him for a draft pick or another player with a lower or expiring contract.
by Al Bundy is my hero on Jun 21, 2011 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed
If the Raps can get out from under Bargnani’s contract for a draft pick (and I mean any draft pick in the first round) and cap relief, they’ve made a good deal. Expecting anything more back for one of the least productive forwards in the NBA is what will prevent him from being traded (ehem… BC).
Trading him for a draft pick would involve trading into a TPE or cap space – thus creating the TPE you so desperately wanted to avoid. I agree, trading him for lesser salary is the way to go – as I posted early in this conversation.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Of course. I was responding to this.
Trade him for a draft pick or another player with a lower or expiring contract.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions
That Is Only Your Opinion
They are talking about a 10 year deal.
SISTM that everything is on the table including wiping away past obligations. There is lots of precedent for this including GM and Chrysler bond holders getting screwed out of their rights in their respective bankruptcy rulings.
Noit going to bother digging up a quote or date, but I too have suggested dealing Bargs to the Cavs to pair with Varajeo.
Talkinf fantasy bball on twitter http://twitter.com/FinalsFantasy#
by JumpShootersRUS on Jun 21, 2011 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions
That would be a massive step down for Cleveland fans if they thought they had a shot at Rudy Gay for the 4th pick (a rumour from earlier this offseason) and only end up with Bargnani.
Repost, citing relevancy as my motivation...
My thoughts on why Knight might work well here…
The biggest plus side I see in drafting Knight is that it allows the Raptors to develop a very consistent offense.
Because Knight and Bayless are such similar players, you develop an offense that suits one, and it automatically suits the other.
This means that for such a young team across the board, you don’t have to make them all learn two different types of offensive schemes based on which PG is in the game at the time…
It allows one PG to be switched for the other seamlessly without missing a beat or changing the gameplan…
It would be much easier to coach these young players and develop them, without needing to add the confusion of knowing that the two guys getting minutes running the offense, are going to run completely different offenses because their own skillsets are so different…
I don’t think either Knight or Bayless will ever be a “next level” PG but I think that the stability they could provide would really help the team build around them, knowing exactly what they’re going to provide every night…
"the Truth"
by Mikthaniel on May 30, 2011
It sounds like Walker is similar enough to Knight that the same would hold true for him as well…
"the Truth"
Raptors Have 'Great Interest' In Knight
Jun 21, 2011 10:16 AM EDT
The Raptors, who pick fifth in this week’s draft, have have eyes for point guard Brandon Knight.
“He’s a big-time athlete, big-time motor,” Raptors director of scouting Jim Kelly said after Knight’s workout on June 7. “[He] can really fly up and down the court there.”
Most important may be what Knight brings defensively. If Casey is indeed the Raptors’ next coach, his defense will only be as good as the guys on the floor.
“[Knight] has all the tools to be a good defender,” Kelly said. “That’s one of the reasons we have great interest in him.”
The Raptors owe point guard Jose Calderon more than $20 million over the next two seasons and also have combo guards Leandro Barbosa (who has a player option this summer) and Jerryd Bayless on the roster. But that won’t stop them from selecting Knight.
“At this point, especially when we’re in the top part of the Draft at No. 5, we’re looking for the best possible player,” Kelly said. “And there happens to be a number of very good point guards there.”
Via John Schuhmann/NBA.com
Draft Order and Personal Big Board
My Prediction
1. Irving
2. Williams
3. Knight
4. Kanter
My Big Board
1. Williams
2. Kanter
3. Knight
4. Walker
5. Singleton
Possible monkey wrench in the cogs of the machine:
Utah reportedly wanting to move Millsap or Jefferson…
I could see the Jazz thinking; draft Kanter with 3 pick, draft Jimmer with their 12th pick.
This would make fans happy, they can see whether Jimmer can supplant Harris, and have an excellent prospect big in Kanter, while dumping salary in the face of a new CBA…
"the Truth"
Ammendment to my big board...
1. Williams
2. Irving
3. Kanter
4. Knight
5. Walker
6. Singleton
Missed Irving because I know he’s not an option…
"the Truth"
Casey press conference live on the score and raptors.com just started
elephant shell
never question our ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory - yardly
sorry
http://www.nba.com/raptors/raptorspacelive_video
elephant shell
never question our ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory - yardly
Thanks for the link
Got stuck in meetings at work but I’ll be catching up this evening.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions
“The players WILL know how important that defense is, and I want to show them that it can be fun!”
T-Dot Bad News Boys!
"the Truth"
“If they’re not playing the defense I think they should be, their playing time is gonna be sittin beside me on the bench talkin about why…”
"the Truth"
LOL
Bargnani better bring a comfortable chair!
I can see the headlines now: “Franchise” player demands padded bench.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
“Franchise” player eats lots of Primo pasta, pads own shorts.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
awesome
Dave "Howland" Randell
Co-Creator of RaptorsHQ.com
by RaptorsHQ - Howland on Jun 21, 2011 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Raptors retooling...
Now that Casey is official, which free agents get offers put out?
Evans, Weems, Wright, Dorsey…
I think with the Barbosa situation, Weems gets a minimum offer…
Evans, I see a sign and trade coming…
Dorsey, a minimum deal as bench depth to lay a bruising on someone…
"the Truth"
DeMar claims he is committed to taking on the role of defensive leader this year, "especially given the position that I play"
Sounds good, let’s see it happen now…
"the Truth"
Except that we have seen that DD can talk about improving in an area and actually make it happen. For example, he managed to develop a decent mid range game after talking about how he needed to improve in his shooting.
I do agree that we need to be skeptical about such commitments but there’s at least a bit of history that suggests that DD might be able to honour the commitment.
DeMar Is Casey's Guy
From the photo-opt of Casey with DeMar and BC as well as Casey and DeMar’s history etc it is rather obvious that DeMar is Casey and the Raptors guy.
DeMar will not get benched when he screws up on defense time and time again.
The Most That Casey Will Do With DeMar During A Game
when DeMar screws up on defense time and time again is talk to DeMar about it during a time-out.
If you want to look at the glass half full you could speculate that Casey should have an easy time communicating his defensive concepts to DeMar given their previous relationship. DeRozan is a hard worker, so if he understands what Casey wants him to do he will certainly try to do it. Perhaps DeMar will not be able to execute Casey’s desired defensive schemes due to some physical or mental deficiency, but if that is the case benching him won’t make him improve.
Its Not About Communicating What DeMar Has To Do
Its about
1. Is DeMar smart enough to grasp what needs to be done?
2. Even if he is smart enough he has played one way his entire life, so it won’t be so easy to unlearn bad habits and replace them with good ones.
3. We know that DeMar is committed to getting better on offense but we have no evidence to suggest that he will play smart and hard on defense and has the tools to become a good defender. Jose plays hard and smart on defense. He just doesn’t the skill. So wanting to play hard on defense while the first step in becoming a good defender is no guarantee that a player will be a good defender.
There is no doubt that DeMar is now the face of the franchise. All you had to do was see that photo-op of DeMar with BC and Casey. BC and Casey could have done it with any of the Raptors players simply by BC making a phone call and telling the player to be at the presser and be prepared for a photo-op. However, they chose DeMar specifically.
Right now DeMar is the Raptors second scoring option behind Bargnani and slightly ahead of Bayless. Casey is not going to sit the new face of the Raptors and long time buddy DeMar his second offensive option for long periods of time just because DeMar screws up on defense.
I am a big fan of DeMar but I want to see him become a lock down defender at the #2 before I believe it.
Casey And Challenges Of Coaching DeMar
Fair point.
Looking at things from the organizational point of view. DeMar is the clear go-to option if you need a Raptor for a photo op. Is the most widely known and popular Raptor for the casual fan. He competed in the dunk contest so he’s got the excitement factor, and they know without a doubt that he’s going to be on the team for the next few years if they choose to keep him.
We can’t pretend that special treatment doesn’t exist in the NBA. And it is unfortunate that a second year player that has so much to improve on, is being featured like that. Casey’s hands are somewhat tied, but he’s just going to have to find a another way. Bringing in some no-nonsense vets, like Antonio Davis and Oak back in the day, could help keep DeMar’s ego in check and hopefully prevent a repeat of the Vince Carter situation.
I just don't see
the VC attitude in Demar… then again I didn’t see the VC attitude in VC until his 2nd last season….
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jun 21, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Paying your dues and having the personality for it
While I don’t see VC in Demar, I do think its easy for young players to get the wrong idea when everyone around them is saying that they are the light of the world. More a precaution then anything else. Because once someone has bought into the hype completely, it is VERY difficult to tip the scales the other way, without them taking it personally.
It’s more about earning status instead of being handed it. Having any second year player being touted “face of the franchise” is something you’d avoid if you could. Ie Chris Bosh grew into that role, and had the higher profile once his performance warranted it. Until then he was that young guy with potential that everyone appreciated for how hard he fought despite his skinny frame.
With Demar, I think the teams lack of talent has placed him into the spotlight before both the person and the game are ready. As a fan favourite, I have no issue with promoting DeMar. However, when it comes to face of the franchise, there is a media component and a leadership component. I would rather that was shared between DeMar and say Amir and Calderon. It is part of the reason why I was a fan of the Young Gunz marketing campaign. Promote a group, instead of deifying a second year player, and putting him under the collective fan microscope.
One benefit to Kemba is that he would be a great check to DeRozan, since he seems to have the personality that can lead and take on their fare share of media duties. Odd for a rookie, but he does have lots of aspects to his game, along with the experience of being the face of UCONN during their run. Demar didn’t have any of that in his one year at USC. (at least i don’t think so)
In reality, DeMar has his head on straighter than Vince ever did...
He’s been talking about working hard since day one. He picks one thing to work on and he busts his ass to master it, then picks a new thing…
He started last year needing to add more aggression and new moves to his offense… enter the DeRozan spin move and increase in foul shots…
He said he needed to shoot better, he worked on his jumper and became lethal from mid-range…
Now he says he’s gonna work on extending his range and leading the team on defense… I am inclined to believe he means every word of it…
Casey’s hands aren’t tied when it comes to holding DeMar accountable, because DeMar already holds himself accountable…
That’s the difference between the “next” franchise guy and the “last” franchise guy…
"the Truth"
re: Difference between coaching DeMar and Ed Davis
No doubt that DeMar has made strides in working on his game. No doubt that he works hard.
I would direct you to the response to dhackett above, since it applies to this comment as well.
Every player should be holding themselves accountable, and the coach on top of that. It’s Casey’s job on the line if the suits think he isn’t providing the right coaching to DeMar.
My point is that coaching Demar is more complicated then coaching say Ed Davis. Ed Davis doesn’t have any hype, posters, dunk contest wins, etc. Thus you’re not going to have the major media, fans, relatives, in his ear saying he’s being marketed like he’s “THE MAN”, so why isn’t the organization treating him like that ie more shots, plays run, parking space for his mom, etc. With Ed Davis, you also have Amir ahead of him on the depth chart. So if he’s being inconsistent, there are better options available and a warm seat on the pine. And we saw that many times in his first season.
With Demar there are no pure SGs behind him on the depth chart and none in front of him. The team can’t afford to manipulate his minutes, which was one of Buddahfan’s points. Thus the motivator / incentive/positive reinforcement would have to come in another way.
Agreed
Every account I’ve heard from the assistant coaches is that Demar is a tireless worker. I remember hearing from “inside sources” in news reports after Vince left that he was extremely lazy and didn’t work at his craft. So I see a big difference between the two.
Need vs Best Player
.
This argument seems to forget, that once you’ve passed the first 2 or 3 picks, there really is no consensus pick out there. So unless BC snags a higher pick, drafting for need just seems like the logical thing to do.
The more important question is ….. what are our real needs?
- PG – Somehow I can’t fathom a Jose/Jarryd combo for the entire season. I’m inclined to pick a Point Guard for this draft – and my gut tells me Walker could work under Jose. As a mentor, and future back-up PG (he only has 2 seasons left of his BIG contract), Calderon would help develop this draft potential.
What could be disastrous, is if Calderon is moved, and we have (not this year but next year), another one of those PG scraps. JB could be a great back-up, but to start him just asks for consequences. We have a young team, and the QB needs to be cognizant of the youth, as well as a calming force for all the mistakes we’ll see again this year.
- SF – Johnson makes for a great role player (with potential to go further), but to put him in the spotlight of a Starter, just asks for trouble. Kleiza is an unknown entity at this time, so it’s possible BC makes a trade or goes for Leonard in the draft. From what I’ve read, the next draft should see a greater choice at SF, so it’s possible BC plugs this hole for the time being (with Kleiza out), and takes his chances on next season’s draft.
- C – Every team wants a defensive Centre. Even Dallas – as Chandler will love the appreciation he gets via Free Agency (ie. big bucks). Drafting a Centre is always a risk, one that requires patience. As such, part of me believes you leave this choice to the last – in developing a Contender. Orlando has their C, but lacks a number of other parts. Dallas filled in all the parts, then added a C.
For a team like Toronto, the Dallas option seems a better fit – and not because of the Dirk / Andrea BS. Whether we admit it or not, Free agents are reluctant to be a part of this team. Remember – this is Toronto – designated by ESPN, as one of the worst sports cities in North America)
If the Raptors had a team that was on the cusp of winning it all, but was without a true Centre – and that lacking was well known amongst free agents – the chances of countering the Canadian phenomenon become so much better. As such, drafting a Centre – IMO – is 3rd on the list of needs.
.
All this being said, I’m leaning towards Walker and revitalizing our PG situation. That of course, assumes Irving & Williams are off the board when we get our chance.
.
For the record, Hoffa was drafting for need while apparently in some sort of drug-addled state of mind. Big difference there.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
The Hoffa Pick
tended to be more of a forced pick.
When I said pick by need, it was under the assumption that after the top few picks, the next group of draftees would be subjective picks. Which to me means no clear cut choice as to “best player”. And in that light, the pick should be swayed by need.
.
In relation to Hoffa, he may have been chosen for need, but the question is …. was that a D-League need, or NBA need. lol
.
by RapthoseLeafs on Jun 21, 2011 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Who was "forcing" Babcock to select Hoffa!?!?!?
That pick came way out of the blue… I heard an interview with Babcock after his termination and he flat out said he selected Hoffa because they needed a centre. It was the classic example of picking for a need and the perfect example why its usually a terrible strategy to follow.
re: Drafting a C over a PG ( If that PG is Kemba Walker)
Re: C Needs
I can see how wanting more of a sure thing instead of a risk is appealing. That being said, supply and demand dictates that you’re better off covering all your bases. Draft a C AND aggressively pursue FA and trades. There is a very small pool of candidates, and teams would rather overpay to keep the centers because they know how hard they are to acquire. I would be content with veteran stopgaps while a younger center develops. Especially since the bar for a starting center isn’t set high in terms of talent and skillset. Its a shame we don’t have bigmen staying in college for at least three years like the old days. Reduce the risk and have them develop faster, solving two problems at once.
Re: SF needs
I agree that stop gaps at this position are plentiful, its one of the deeper positions in any draft or free agent pool. It’s also probably one of the easiest positions to acquire a top tier talented player.
re: PG needs
I would like to see a PG drafted who is capable of being a solid option for a number of years. TJ Ford and the troubles he had at his size and frame make me hesitant about similar PGs whose bodies might not stand the test of time. If Kemba was a top offensive option for the Raptors, his body would take a beating. That’s the main reason why a PG’s size is important to me, besides defense. On THIS Raptors team, the PG can’t afford to just run plays and pass the ball. They need to get right in there, and make things happen on offense. We are lacking in the kinds of players that can carry that load, and in past Raptor history (Stoudamire, Mike James, TJ Ford) it falls on the PG to pick up the slack.
With this mix of thoughts in mind, I favor Jonas V above all. After that, Kawhi has complications with James Johnson, and also with the possibility of a more all-around SF available next year. Brandon Knight has a ways to go, but so did Kemba when he was a freshman. Presence of Bayless also complicates things. There are no clear cut options, however, I think that I would be itching to upgrade to a bigger PG after a few years. Thus I’m willing to hold out for something better. With centers, the bar is lower and depth at center is a great thing to have, cause everyone is always in the market.
Now That The Raptors Have Replaced Trinao
The next guy to go should be Devlin
by Buddahfan on Jun 21, 2011 1:54 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
So true
Let me rec it for you.
If we won’t have a winning season for a few years, let’s at least have a good play-by-play guy to help pass the seasons.
Devlin Shoud Get Canned Period
whether the Raptors are winning or losing.
What I find interesting is that Devlin IMO is a lot better play by play guy when he calls the playoff games on TNT then when he does the Raptors play by play.
IMO way too much PC homer and favorites play calling by Devlin on Raptors games.
leo nees to go before Devlin
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jun 21, 2011 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Both should exit stage left.
I think back now to all the Bon Jovi singing etc and I want to puke. Can you imagine TNT showing that stuff in one of the conference final series’? If this team wants to be taken seriously, its entire culture needs to change.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions
So Casey Spent A Lot Of Time Working With His Guy DeMar
Can we expect DeMar to be sitting on the bench, after that photo opt with Casey and BC, when DeMar screws up on defense time and time again?
Or will we see
BC has his guy in Bargnani
and now
Casey has his guy in DeMar.
So Casey said that James Johnson is part of the core. Very Interesting.
Players mentioned by Casey
DeMar
Bargnani
Calderon
Bayless
James Johnson
Will be interesting
Raptors Core
Add in
Davis
Amir Johnson
Kawhi Leonard @#5
to
DeMar
Bargnani
Calderon
Bayless
J Johnson
and you have the new rotation, who will
learn how to play Casey “D”
Colangelo still needs to bring in a FA center who can
protect the basket and rebound and ready to go
Casey has his work cut out for him
Interesting article that praises Casey and also sets out some of the onerous challenges that lie ahead of him: http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/06/21/fixing-raptors-defense-no-easy-task-for-casey/
Some interesting quotes:
When attempting to explain why the Raptors were "one of the worst defensive teams in modern NBA history", the author had this to say:
"The personnel had a lot to do with that. Jose Calderon tries hard and talks a ton, but he’s a swinging door at point guard. Andrea Bargnani, the franchise centerpiece, is among the worst big men in the league in terms of help defense, closing on shooters and rebounding. The inexperienced wing players and front-line guys — DeMar DeRozan, Ed Davis and Amir Johnson — have shown some flashes, but they are young and raw, and they come with the usual flaws of players who are young and raw."
Also interesting, but not at all surprising indictment of the Triangelo regime: "Players complained about a lack of accountability". Really? When one of the worst big men in the game plays 35 + minutes, I’d say there is a lack of accountability.
I Wouldn't Call Amir Raw
He will be in his seventh season.
Still needs more experience but who doesn’t? That is how you learn.
For all the slamming of Calderon he still outplayed his opponents over 50% of the time. (Link previously provided). While I agree that the Raptors need to upgrade the PG with Bayless, Jose is not that bad of a player regardless of what his haters say.
I remember conversations on this very site questioning whether “lack of accountability” was a real issue because no one was being vocal about it during the season. The same issues will be present next season if Casey continues to roll out the unlimited minutes / shot attempts for Bargnani while looking the other way on defense. This is the biggest single issue facing the team moving forward – Bargs HAS TO be moved.
Geoff Rahal
Author, RaptorsHQ.com
by RaptorsHQ - Defensive Stance on Jun 21, 2011 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, to your point – what if Bargs isn’t moved, but Casey actually does what he says he will do, ie sit Bargnani if he doesn’t show defensive effort? Would that not achieve the same result?
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
And
the slamming and hate dislike (against AB), along with moron opinions by “sports writers” like Fesschuck, doesn’t affect value? It’s like walking into a home for sale – while the owner is there – and telling them this is the best house you’ve seen – hands down.
Good negotiators STFU. Bad negotiators just wonder why they FU.
.
I think it says it all, when someone suggested Bargs & our 5th pick, to Cleveland for their 4th pick.
.
From Andrea’s perspective, Casey could be the best medicine. No more coddling. Take the shot when it’s there, not when it’s not. As well, more productive minutes (28 – 32 min range). DC strikes me as someone who can prod, without “scarring” – something Mitch couldn’t handle well enough.
.
.
by RapthoseLeafs on Jun 21, 2011 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Ideally he gets moved (of course), but in the sense of accountability issues (which I thought we were discussing), I don’t see the difference.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions
All pieces of the discussion have to viewed as part of the team as a whole...
So when you say it effectively does the same thing, you are ignoring the other ramifications of the action.
"the Truth"
My response was to:
The same issues will be present next season if Casey continues to roll out the unlimited minutes / shot attempts for Bargnani while looking the other way on defense.
I don’t see why this would be the case. And as such, those specific issues could be solved by him NOT looking the other way, etc. Of course there are loads of issues with this team. But I disagree that the Raptors cannot improve with Bargnani as part of the team. The easiest way is to move him, and likely the best way too, but I’m not so narrow minded as to assume it is the only way.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Here’s the problem and why it is the only way. He can’t play centre. Just can’t. Don’t care if God almighty came down and fused Phil Jackson and Pat Riley into one uber coach to try and "prod’ him. If he plays PF he takes minutes awy from Amir and Davis. Arguable two of the Raptors most promissing young players. Plus paying Bargnani $10 mil a year is probably one of the most ineficient things you could do with cap space, especially in what will probably be a more stringent cap envireonment with the new CBA. So yes, by staying he is actually impeding the teams development and chances for improvement. Understanding this is not “narrow minded” but pragmatic and intelligent.
The statistical numbers Buddha provided clearly demonstrate that Bargs is the closest to a feasible basketball player when he plays Center...
He is marginally worse at PF, and downright gawdawful at SF…
He plays his best as C, and that best is nowhere near good enough…
"the Truth"
re: Casey and Andrea
The days for unlimited shot attempts and minutes will decrease naturally as the team becomes deeper and Ed Davis gains experience. Outside observers of the Raptors know what Bargs does well, and what he doesn’t. I don’t think they will care if he’s playing 30, 35, or 40 minutes. His playing time is more a commentary of what we think of him, and how he fits in the context of our team.
Casey was in demand and he’s likely already outlined what his plans for the roster and Bargnani in particular will be.
It would be advantageous to Andrea to make some contact with Casey and find out first hand where his mind is at regarding where the team is going. No phone or text, in person. Cause Casey has the duration of the lockout to flesh out his ideas on how that cap money should be spent, and roles in which the incumbents need to be replaced.
I think Bargnani needs to spend this summer locked in the gym at Beneton Treviso with a personal trainer, executing a training and development regime that’s geared towards what Casey sees as his role moving forward. Make a great impression in training camp, because he’s auditioning for his place on the team just like everyone else.
Amir With One Tweet After The Presser
IamAmirJohnson Amir Johnson
trust issues
I have no idea what it means or whether it even relates to the Raptors or not. If it does it certainly is interesting given that was all he has tweeted since yesterday.
https://twitter.com/#!/IamAmirJohnson
Probably something else... this followed...
IamAmirJohnson Amir Johnson
S/O to D Case our new head coach #raptornation
19 minutes ago
"the Truth"
You Are Guessing
I have no idea what it means.
It just could have been a random thought or maybe more than that.
No point in parsing it any longer as we will probably never know what he meant by it.
I bet you it has to do with his new tat... he got all his ink done and told the guy, "I'll pay you Friday" and the guy was all like, "cash now b*tch!"
That MUST be it…
You’re the one who started the wild conjecture… I just gave it another angle…
"the Truth"
It might have something to do with
Weems. Maybe he lent him some money.
.
by RapthoseLeafs on Jun 21, 2011 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Or maybe Reggie slept with Lebron's mom?
Why not? It’s a popular thing for athletes to do isn’t it?
I mean, I don’t find her attractive but…
"the Truth"
D-Wade and DeMar
Ira Winderman: Pat Riley on Dwyane Wade, “I think Dwyane is the best defensive two-guard in the league when he wants to be.” Twitter
Has anyone here ever seen Riley or Spoelstra sit Wade when Wade doesn’t want to play defense?
It is not going to happen either with the new face of the Raptors franchise. Count on it.
Bull crap
Winning sells tickets. I would also argue defence does sell tickets in Toronto. Some of the most beloved Toronto players and teams were the ones who rebounded and played good defence. Work ethic is revered in TO.
Teams Don't Play Defense During The Regular Season Except in The 4th Quarter
Offense is what sells regular season tickets.
Offense and 4th quarter lock down defense gets a team into the playoffs
48 minutes of defense is what wins in the playoffs.
ummm
someone forgot to tell Boston, Chicago and Miami that……
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jun 21, 2011 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Except the Knicks. They are the only team in the playoffs not in the top 18 defensively in the league.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Offense draws crowds - Defense keeps them there
.
Vinny & CB are 2 big examples of what draws crowds – flash.
Invariably it’s the crowds that pay the bills. Ask Harold B. how that use to work for the Leafs.
.
by RapthoseLeafs on Jun 21, 2011 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
For Reggie Lovers
WolstatSun Ryan Wolstat
FWIW Casey coached Reggie Evans for a few seasons in Seattle.
Casey and Andrea
He can’t sit Andrea because it would lessen his trade value.
He can’t play him because it will hurt the culture of the team he is trying to create.
Andrea put up decent numbers last year because we forced the ball into his hands relentlessly and we paid a 22 win season price for that approach. Let’s trade him now while he still has that perceived value of 21 pts per.
If we keep Andrea then he will have a smaller role on the team with Casey at the helm. He could develop into a different player and maybe provide scoring off the bench, but his trade value would decrease and he doesn’t fit in Toronto. There is some baggage there that mandates he has to go.
I am thrilled we are going to hire a defensive minded coach. Now trade Andrea while he is worth something and let’s move on. Get a good pick at 5.
Then we have JJ, Ed, Amir, JB, JC, Demar, plus whatever we get back for Andrea and the 5th pick. I could get excited about our future with that lineup.
this is exactly it
there ofcourse is the possibility that he suddenly gets it and finally works out….. but given that after 5 years he hasn’t, its not a chance worth taking.
The biggest risk right now is NOT moving Andrea… (ofcourse the catch 22 is can Andrea even be moved?)
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jun 21, 2011 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions
its not a chance worth taking.
Define worth? Do you mean as in we’re Contenders this year, and we can’t afford having this kind of player affect that run for a Ring?
The biggest risk right now is NOT moving Andrea…
Risk for what?
Like the guy who loaned Sonny – money? Or the risk that Garbajosa took, playing overseas after his injury?
.
Everyone talks about how players abilities (or skill set) are “cemented in”, with no further changes possible. However, one might want to ask guys like Dirk – who have elevated their game after many years in the league – how going to a next level is possible.
.
by RapthoseLeafs on Jun 21, 2011 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Dirk’s abilities were cemented in by his 3rd (if not 2nd) year in the league. NOT 6 years later.
You REALLY need to stop making your Dirk and Andrea comparisons. They are ridiculous.
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jun 21, 2011 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
RapthoseLeafs, do you ever get tired or frustrated being the one guy, I mean the ONE SINGULAR guy who thinks the way you do about Bargnani? Do you ever question yourself when everyone disagrees with you? I mean everyone. Even Renato,his countryman has abandoned this battle, . It’s really kind of sad now…
MAS...your obsession has become comical
Even if RapthoseLeafs view was singular (which its not), so what. Your obsession with promoting the “everyone must have the same view or they are an idiot” has grown really old. Yes there are others who shared RapthoseLeafs views who don’t aprticipate very frequently anymore….it doesn’t mean we have been convinced that Bargnani can never under any circumstances ever contribute anything positive…maybe those posters just grew tired of the same arguments over and over.
The link RapthoseLeafs posted is very interesting. The interview doesn’t sugarcoat deficiencies. But I’m sure that if Casey says anything positive, then he too must be an idiot, or a puppet.
I’ll point to Buddahfan’s post below. What the hell is he supposed to say? Undermining Bagnani will just undermin the likely hood of him getting traded. Which is the oposite of what Dwayne Casey wants to do.
And its not that you grew tired of the same arguments, its that you have no arguments to refute the obvious. Look if you and RapthoseLeafs come clean and say "I realize that every piece of statistical data points to Bargnani being one of the least productive players in the league, but I like the kid because I’m a fan (or because he plays for the Raptors or he’s from my home town or wahtever other irrational example) I’d be fine and would not downgrade you for that. However, trying to make arguments that the vast majority of Raptors fans and 99% of analysts, writers, experts, other NBA players etc. are Bargnani haters because we look at the evidence and draw reasonable conclusions, is just sad.
Give Us A Break
What did you expect him to say.
Bargnani stinks and will never get better.
That would get back to Italy so fast it would make your head spin.
No doubt Casey has learned how to say the appropriate and PC things in public. Good for him. That is a very good quality to have.
Trade Bargnani now.
Kelly Dwyer Says Hiring Casey Won't Do Squat Until the Raptors
move Bargnani and Calderon who he claims are untradeable and get some players who can play
And I completely agree.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Jun 21, 2011 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
The Raptors Will Probably Draft Knight
but given that the NBA and NBA Players union appear to be still miles apart on a 10 year agreement which could very well lead to a lockout ISTM if Valanciunas is available at #5 the Raptors should draft him even he is going to spend what cold be a lockout season in Europe.
Casey will try and come up with some way to motivate Baragnani and he will get his minutes next season if their is even a 2011-12 season.
Word is that even with Valanciunas agreeing to stay in Europe for one more season that he already has at least one a guarantee from a team drafting in the top 10.
Raptors Draft
Alot of you guys have been saying that the raptors have hole at the center, small forward and shooting guard spots and I believe that this is not the draft to fill those needs.
-Firstly in this draft there is no shooting guard who is currently better or who has more ptotential than Demar Derozan and we all have seen his improvement from his rookie season.
-Secondly at the SF position the raptors have alot of maby’s which in the NBA is not good enough, it is definately a position which they need to improve at. Although I like James Johnson because he is young he is more an energy who can come off the bench. Kawhi Leonard is alot like Gerald wallace but i feel that this is not the right draft to get him especially when the 2012 draft is loaded with talented SF (perry jones, harrison barnes etc.)
-At center I believe this is a position which the raptors should either trade for or go the route of free agency as drafting a “project” like bismack beyombo is not the greatest move and that bringing in a proven veteren is the best choice.
-The raptors are already deep at the PF position
-That just leaves the pg position, what the raptors need is a guy who can penetrate and can play defense without getting blown by evertime, calderon is the exact opposite of what I just described. Personally I feel the pg inability to guard your man one on one is a large part of the raptors poor defence as the other four guys on the court have to constantly be helping calderon out, my solution to this problem is to draft kemba or knight to athletic guys who can play d-fence
Chad Ford Latest - Knight, Biyombo or Leonard - No Walker and No Vesely
The Raptors’ hiring of Dwane Casey may affect their draft plans. Casey is a defensive specialist, and when he looks at the Raptors’ roster, there isn’t much to like on that front. GM Bryan Colangelo has built an offensive juggernaut, but defensively they’re pretty terrible. That may explain why the team is zeroing in on three excellent defenders — Brandon Knight, Bismack Biyombo and Kawhi Leonard — at No. 5. I’ve had Jan Vesely going here for weeks, and others have been pushing for Kemba Walker here, but it sounds like neither player is atop their board right now.
Those are also my top three though I would prefer Valanciunas.
NBA History Shows That Younger Lottery Picks Have Greater Chance of Success
There is no perfect formula to factor age into the equation, but the trend is that a younger, highly drafted player will have more success than an older one
complete article on link
Update on Valanciunas
As I wrote in my mock draft, news that Jonas Valanciunas won’t play in the NBA next season makes it unlikely the Cavs will select him at No. 4. However, it doesn’t mean the Cavs still won’t draft him. I’m hearing the Cavs are exploring moving down a few spots in the draft to take him. The goal is to secure another first-round pick to compensate them for not getting Valanciunas to play this season. One potential scenario has the Wizards giving up Nos. 6 and 18 for the No. 4 pick. The caveat? Enes Kanter has to be there at No. 4 for the Wizards. If he’s not, there’s no deal.
The Cavs, for their part, would take Valanciunas at No. 6 and add a third asset at No. 18. Jordan Hamilton and Marshon Brooks are among the possibilities with the latter pick.
If the Cavs don’t select Valanciunas, it appears he still won’t fall out of the lottery. I have him at No. 14 in my latest mock. But I’m hearing this afternoon that the Bucks might select him at No. 10 if he’s on the board, and the Warriors are even more likely to take him at No. 11.
Looking More and More Like Knight is The Pick
Casey and Knight two KY guys.
I can understand that.
One intangible in drafting Knight is that he will push Bayless and vice-versa as they are both similar type players though Knight may have the potential to become a better defender.
You Can Bet That Casey Has Been On The Phone With Calipari About Knight
It seems to me like a go.
This will mean Barbosa will most likely not return and the four Guards for next season pending a trade will be
Calderon
Bayless
DeRozan
Knight
I could say “Good Knight” at this time but it is still afternoon in Los Angeles. LOL
Except Barbosa is in full control of whether he is back or not...
And Jose would be traded if we drafted Knight…
So, DeRozan and Barbosa (?), maybe Weems re-signs for cheap as DeMar’s understudy…
And Bayless backed up by Knight…
"the Truth"
VG Money In Brazil for Barbosa
Raptors point guard more than Reina – Barbosa end of the season will face a choice, that is, if the next season contract worth $ 7,600,000, to remain in the NBA, or return to their homeland a local basketball league campaign in Brazil . The news was Barbosa’s brother – Arturo – Barbosa said, it caused a reaction to the outside world.
"Now playing in Brazil also earn a lot of money." Arturo said in an interview that the case, he had served as private trainer for many years Barbosa, "where there are many sponsors, so there still playing can make a lot of money, so I want to open their horizons to Barbosa, the opportunity to look at those, we really like Toronto, where the fans like, and he would like to stay there, but business is business, is also a return to Brazil to play One of our options, we have will be considered.
"If Barbosa returned to Brazil to play, he will be the same as those football players earn a lot of money because he is back from the NBA players, many sponsors are flocking to him, we all know his name, because he is the pride of Brazil. "Barbosa’s agent, Jeff and now Sam has not commented on this matter.
complete article on link
Ok, what part of his brother saying he has options indicates to you that he won't be back?
Furthermore you said that he wouldn’t be back likely because the Raptors would draft Knight, not because he can make money in Brazil…
You Can Bet That Casey Has Been On The Phone With Calipari About Knight. It seems to me like a go. This will mean Barbosa will most likely not return
?
"the Truth"
Weems Is A Lousy NBA Player
Don’t sign him. Let some other team sign the debt dodger.
Lol, I was alone on the wrong thread!
I liked what I was hearing from Casey. Getting excited already. Suddenly I am wondering about a guy like Alibi, this might be a situation for him to thrive in. Had to laugh at Casey’s reaction to having JT as an assistant coach-don’t think he was too interested in that. Triano might make a great offensive coordinator for a team, but you can’t bring back last year’s head coach. New dude, new locker room, new era. Damn, I AM getting excited already!
And Special Ed! Casey is pretty much the perfect coach for Ed Davis. Ed already plays the way Casey is preaching, this will be a long and beautiful relationship! Does this mean Bayless is more likely to be next year’s starter? Will Casey be able to make players better defensively, better using the talents of players like DeMar, Johnson, Kleiza? This HAS to affect who we draft, and I can’t see it helping Kemba Walker’s case. Whoever we draft had better have the ability to have an impact on the defensive end, and there will be a few players like that available at 5. Kemba ain’t one. Hello Coach Casey, this is Andrea Bargnani… Andrea is ALWAYS an enigma. What if Casey can teach AB how to use his length and athleticism? I do think that if Bargs is around, his ass will be seeing a lot more bench unless he improves his defensive intensity. Bargnani is young enough, and possibly smart enough, to figure out that if he listens to coach he will be a better player and therefore see more floor time. If he doesn’t? F—k him, he can come off the bench. Who knows – I would love to be a fly on the wall when those two meet!
Walker McKenna
by Robert Archibald on Jun 21, 2011 6:16 PM EDT reply actions
Davis Does A Lot Of Things Good
especially chewing gum while players blow past him for easy baskets.
Davis does not play hard.
He is Mr. gum chewing cool out on the floor.
I like Davis’ upside but I don’t see being an energy player as part of his personality.
+1 on Ed Davis
In the words of Jenge, Casey seem like a “button his polo up to the top guy”
And having BC make mention about the new coach having the option of having the ex-coach on his staff (Tim and Sid podcast linked awhile back)…I think Colangelo has forgotten where the usual boundry between coach and GM is suppose to be. With an experienced coach, he picks his own staff. And holdovers from the old regime are limited to the odd assistant coach, not the ex-coach, and completely at the discretion of the new coach.
For me I would take Brandon Knight. Even though Kemba Walker is a point guard he plays more like a SG and at that position he is undersized and at the NBA level that will be a huge disadvantage. Knight is the prototypical PG who has a more dynamic NBA game. He has tremendous upside and I wouldnt underestimate that. Though Calderon and Bayless are serviceable they are definetly replaceable. I would take this gamble with Knight. We are a rebuilding franchise so we have the time to let him develop into the great player that he will become.
Hmmm
Would Knight be an Alvin Williams type PG? ADub was never an all star but he was better than anything since him. I wonder if he’ll be around?
Walker McKenna
by Robert Archibald on Jun 21, 2011 6:23 PM EDT reply actions
ESPN Starts There Draft Show With Kemba Walker
Why does that not surprise me.
Then they throw this BS in that Walker may fall through no fault of his own.
Give us a break. Geez.
Biyombo Takes Single Word Association Test
A lot of teams are giving you serious consideration in the draft. There’s easily 10 or 12 cities where you could wind up. Let’s play a game: I’ll say the name of a city and you say the first word that comes to mind. Any word you want — just the first word that pops into your head.
Cool? Biyombo: Cool. Grantland: OK, here we go. Washington, D.C. Biyombo: No. Grantland: OK. Detroit. Biyombo: Detroit? Yes. Grantland: Toronto. Biyombo: Yes. Grantland: Houston. Biyombo: Yes. ESPN.com
Biyombo Has A Great Sense of Humor
" Now, some people ask me if I can look them in the eye and say I’m really 18. I can look anyone in the eye and tell them that. If they want to believe me, they can believe me, and if they don’t want to believe me, they don’t have to. I’m not President Obama, I’m not gonna hold up my birth certificate in public to show to the world.
It's a cliche, but you gotta go with the best player available
In truth, teams probably combine best player available analysis with drafting for position/need. But when you’re a team that lost sixty some odd games – well, you have to go with best player available. Knight vs. Walker is a very tough call, and chances are either Utah or Cleveland will make it a redundant debate by taking Knight. But assuming he’s still there, I think he’s the pick. Does he have things to work on? Sure. But from what I’ve read about his intelligence and work ethic, as well as what I’ve seen him do on the court, I would roll the dice with him. That said, if the Raps end up with Walker, I’m not complaining. And either of those players is an upgrade over both Calderon and Bayless.
IMO - It Is Not Even Close - Knight Would Be By Far The Better Pick
Walker is undersized and can’t shoot. He is also almost two years older.
Walker was effective at CT, because he was playing against smaller and slower college players so he could get to the basket. It will not be able to do that nearly as effectively in the NBA, IMO.
Knight has far more upside and already is a vastly superior outside shooter. Walker can’t even shoot and make college threes. He will be even worse in the NBA.
Knight over Walker for me any day of the month and year despite what Hollinger’s stats say.
Spurs Talking To Raptors About A Tony Parker Trade
NEW YORK – The San Antonio Spurs are engaged in discussions about trading point guard Tony Parker(notes) to secure a high pick in Thursday’s draft, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.
The Spurs have talked to teams in the lottery, including the Toronto Raptors and Sacramento Kings, who hold the fifth and seventh picks, respectively.
This trade works financially. Would you do it? Parker just turned 29
Calderon, Kleiza, #5 Pick for Parker, #29 Pick.
If The Raptors Have Enough TPE Left To Get Parker
and BC had another trade in place for Calderon
then I would consider using the TPE to get Parker and exchange the #5 and 29th picks.
It would depend on what the trade for Calderon involved.
The Raptors don’t have nearly enough TPE.
Also, I wouldn’t do that trade even if they did – $50 million over the next 4 years? No thank you very much. Even with JC and Kleiza heading back the other way.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 21, 2011 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I Can See That
I am not exactly sure what they think the Raptors would give up for Parker given his salary.
I don’t know – I don’t think I’d do it even for Jose and Kleiza – since it is conditional on giving up our pick.
by dhackett1565 on Jun 22, 2011 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions
This Post Is Informational Only
Seems that Wolstat must read this blog. LOL
WolstatSun Ryan Wolstat
Why again would the Raptors want expensive, injury-prone, no defence playing Tony Parker? Unless it’s for Calderon and Kleiza makes no sense
Right guy, wrong time
Tony Parker has been a terrific player and probably has a few more good years left in him, but he’s the wrong guy for a rebuilding team. Even in a relatively weak draft, I think a fifth overall pick has more value to the Raps than Parker does at this stage of his career.
completely agree
nothing against Parker, but I’d rather see the Raps keep the pick at this point in time
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jun 21, 2011 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
The NBA Needs To Change Their Trade Rules
Instead of matching salaries in the current season, they should match salaries over the life of contracts.
So if you have two players both making $10 million a year but one player has two years left on their contract for a total of $20 million and the other five years for a total of $50 million you could not make the trade.
On the other hand if you had two players with $20 million left on their contracts one for 5 years at $4 million a year and the other for 2 years at $10 million a year then you could do that trade.
Changing The Rule Like This
would prevent teams from taking on a huge increase in salary liability and thus making it difficult for them to easily change their roster due to there dead weight long term salary commitments.
Listen to Casey on Bargnani
On Tim & Sid: Uncut on the score.com raptorblog and Fan 590 McCown
Some words on Andrea
Hes Dirk-like
Hes our Star
One of the best big men shooters in the league
great hands, athletic
made big steps when CB left
needs to focus on defense and Casey will ensure
thats not the first time we’ve heard that….. every time the team gets a new coach, we hear that about Bargnani. Whats this his third? Huh……
Then ofcourse the season starts and all that is proven false… except needing to focus on defense, which ofcourse he doesn’t do.
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Jun 21, 2011 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Casey is saying the right things/ Andrea needs to go or change
If you were the new coach of the Raptors that is exactly what you should say.
Despite his lack of passion, Andrea is young and he is talented…Triano came in and had to overplay him, Casey doesn’t. Please, please trade him; but if you keep him, make him become accountable and make him really, really give a shet.
It is my opinion he should learn to visualize on Defence. Like if he gets the rebound he saves someones life or something. The urgency isn’t there on a nightly basis and he needs to create that urgency to try harder. Even if he needs to lie to himself to falsely create it.
That is one of his biggest issues; hard core fans can’t relate to him. How can a plumber from Brampton, (who buys season tickets for his family and drives in to every game) want the team to get a rebound more than “our” star player? It cannot continue. He needs to go or start making sacrifices to help the team. Either or. If Casey is stuck with him, he said the right thing. If BC is gonna move him, Casey still said the right thing (and can take a big sigh of relief that he won’t have to hope he is more like Dirk than he is like Kukoc.
I think he is a lot like Kukoc, who was ok in the right system. If he stays, I hope he is like Dirk, but I just don’t see it at all yet. Urgency and supreme effort on the defensive end would help me change my opinion. And truthfully, he needs to shoot 5% better from three and 5% from the field and of course add 2.5 rebounds a game and a new ability to play help D.
by defensive rap on Jun 22, 2011 2:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Pizza
I say if we have Andrea next year, we should only give out Pizza if Andrea gets 10 rebounds in a night or he gets 3 blocks. Other than that, if we score 120 pts and lose to GS by 12 pts, no pIzza.
Or if we hold the other team to under 80pts, or under 90 pts would be fair. I say 80 pts though because it is time to start creating the habits of champions and expecting more of our ball club. We have a young team with a lot of talent and it is time to start working hard to develop that talent and elevate this franchise to a more respectable level. All we need to do is win. Go Raps
as much as i really would love to trade bargnani, if the raps cant find a good trade to make, i wouldnt be upset at all ifcasey decides to play him, off the bench of course. i guess im just buying into this defensive system i heard frequently from the dwayne hiring presser and i guess im sold on him to at least teach bargnani a lesson, which is to play better defense, as he did say that if the players dont, theyll be sitting right next to him during the game. better stick to your word casey!
The Mudville Nine, please hit a home run Mr. Casey
And Mr. Casey watched the first pitch go by and heard strike one. The angry crowd roared in disagreement. But Casey told the crowd to quiet down. It was a good pitch not to swing at… When the press asks you loaded questions on the first day you answer two ways,
1. we will stress defence
2. we will make the best of our very talented assets.
Two checkmarks for Casey so far.
Casey said offensively we were one of the hardest teams to prepare for with Terry or Marion struggling to stop Demar. Good answer.
Casey was impressed with the way Demar worked hard in the off season. He must be comparing to what he’s seen, and he’s just seen a veteran team win a championship, so he must know about hard work.
He didn’t say Andrea was a nightmare to match up with.
Later on he essentially says Andrea is very good on O, and needs to work on D. Not a terrible assessment. He’s gotta be positive at this stage for obvious reasons.
Casey says Defence is the key to suture success.
Devlin or ?
Devlin is pretty bad now. He was better when they were winning but he was never a good fit in Toronto.
I would vote clearly and strongly for Eric Smith to be the voice of the Raptors next year or ASAP. He’s intelligent, articulate, and he gets it. AND HE CARES. This would be a huge hire for the Raps and would expand the fan base by 25% in the first three years.
A great guy, with an understanding and passion for sports. I have watched him for years and I think he is one of the most talented guys in Sports Broadcasting in Canada and if we don’t get him soon, TSN may take him as a top guy very soon.
Eric is smart and he has options. The longer we wait, the more options will present themselves to Mr. Smith. Drop Devlin and replace him with Eric Smith? Who would say no to that? The interviews with Casey would be way better and Eric has guts and he gets it.
Go Raps
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
NBA Playoffs Content Module
Related FanPosts on Raptors HQ
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Shaquille O’Neal is in a Chinese beer commercial, too (VIDEO)
- ‘Deep Thoughts’ and Cheap Thoughts: San Antonio Spurs vs. Oklahoma City Thunder
- C-a-C: This is probably as close to LeBron James working with John Waters as we’ll ever get
- Dwyane Wade’s hot pink pants: The kind of thing you can get away with when you drop 41
- Lamar Odom to New York? Dwight Howard on the move? For now, it’s all talk
