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3 In the Key - Raptors' Game-Day Preview vs. Suns

It's not quite the same Vince that the ACC faithful is used to, but expect plenty of boos tonight nonetheless this evening.


The NBA's trade deadline brought a flurry of moves however the Toronto Raptors didn't get involved in a single one of them.  The HQ give their take on this, and yes, preview an interesting match tonight against the Phoenix Suns.

Star-divide

So that's that.

Even though yesterday represented a fairly busy day in terms of trades at the NBA's deadline, there wasn't a peep from Bryan Colangelo and his team.  The Toronto Raptors chose to stand pat, and will take their rag-tag current group through to the end of the season.

How do I feel about it?

Well, hearing some of the names that were bandied about, and the fact that some teams seemingly gave up very little to get solid pieces, an obvious first reaction is one of frustration.  Gerald Wallace is no spring chicken, but couldn't Toronto have made a similar deal with the 'Cats, parlaying the expiring deals of Reggie Evans and Julian Wright in addition to some other cap fodder and a future pick in order to grab him?  I know TO is in "rebuild mode," but at some point the club needs to also add some quality veterans.

That being said, after sitting on the deals for a while, and looking over the landscape of trades, perhaps not making a move was actually the right one.

The fact is that the Raptors, have very little in terms of assets to give up, and if you notice, most of the big moves made yesterday were done by clubs that either had a litany of valuable pieces (OKC sacrificed Jeff Green), or significant cap room (Sacramento) to facilitate movement.

Sure, the Raps are still holding that TPE (approximately $9.1M of it remaining according to BC), but it doesn't die now that the deadline has passed, and Toronto can still use it up until approximately 11 days after July 1 apparently. This means that they can still be a player around draft time, perhaps grabbing another pick in exchange for taking on another less-than-desirable contract, maybe one that is actually of use as by that point, they should know in what direction they're going via the draft.

Say for example the club ends up with the 3rd pick in the draft and has targeted a bit man like Ohio State's Jared Sullinger, or Arizona's Derrick Williams, knowing that Kyrie Irving will be gone.  Then perhaps the club looks to take on a slightly over-priced true C or PG (the draft's two weakest positions), in order to head into July with a re-stocked cupboard.

I don't mind this plan at all, but once again it hinges on Colangelo making the right choice in the draft.  It's too early to get into this now, but the Raps simply have to hit a home run in this one, or at least a solid triple.  The top clubs in the league still build via the draft, fill in the missing pieces via free agency, and hope the whole thing works out.

In fact Toronto's opponent tonight is a good example of this.

The club, ironically under Mr. Colangelo, hit home runs in the draft via Amar'e Stoudemire and Shawn Marion, and even before that, Steve Nash, and were able to surround the trio with enough pieces to be a dominant team in the West for most of the 2000's.

Now though?

The club seems to caught in that NBA Never-Never Land of being decent enough to fight for a playoff spot, yet not good enough to actually win a round.

I asked Seth Pollack from SB Nation's Phoenix Suns' blog, Bright Side of the Sun, his take on the team in this week's edition of "Blogging with the Enemy..."

 

1.  RaptorsHQ:  Now that the Carmelo Anthony business is finally dying down, the NBA rumour mill will turn to other possible stars who could be changing addresses before the NBA's trade deadline.  What's your take on Steve Nash's future with the Suns?  SHOULD they move him now?

Seth Pollack:  No. Moving Nash makes no sense for the Suns. The market for him isn't that high and his value here in Phoenix is far greater than any second tier parts they could get for him now. 

2.  RHQ:  What about a deal that did take place that involved Phoenix recently; how have Carter Pietrus and Gortat worked out so far?  Was this in fact a good move by the Suns in your opinion?

SP:  I am not sure. Carter was obviously the price they had to pay to undo Sarver's Hedo mistake and to get Gortat. Marcin is a solid player. I think he's fairly limited offensively and he's not as big or athletic as you might like but he gets it done. Pietrus is an interesting guy. He's very inconsistent. He can be brilliant and he can leave you wanting to throttle him all within the same game. 

Overall, I still believe Hedo could have worked out in future years and I loved Jason Richardson as a Sun. I also believe that Robin Lopez will develop into a better center than Gortat given time. I still don't think I like the deal but I don't hate it.

3. RHQ:   Keys to tonight's game.  What do the Suns have to do to get the W?

SP:  For the Suns, the keys lately have been consistent bench play from guys like Gortat, Pietrus, Dudley, Warrick and Dragic. Even more important is Channing Frye. He's tearing it up right now with a 22 ppg average over the past four games and over 77 percent shooting! He's rebounding, defending and playing well. When he's going like this, the Suns are hard to beat because the defense has really improved enough that Suns actually are more prone to lose when they can't score as opposed to getting beat on the boards or on defense.    

 

On the Raptors' side, they're of course coming off a big win over the Chicago Bulls, and will be looking to build on the momentum created from that win.

Add in a visit from Steve Nash, always a big night, a Vince Carter appearance, and the fact that it's a Friday night game at the ACC, and this could be one of the better viewing experiences of the year for fans.

Here are our 3 keys:

1)  Intensity.  The major difference for me between the Raptors' win over the Bulls and most of the games they've played this season was the level of intensity that the club played at.  It started right from the tip and as opposed to recent fourth quarter let-downs, extended throughout.  Yes, James Johnson was instrumental in this early, but players like Andrea Bargnani and Sonny Weems carried the torch after that.

Against a hungry Suns team that is 7 and 3 in their last 10 games, and only two games out of a playoff spot, this intensity has to be there again.

2)  Andrea Bargnani.  I didn't know who that guy was playing at center for the Dinos last game, but he had Bargnani's jersey on.

In all seriousness, that was one of the best games I'd seen from Bargs all season.  Yep, his shooting percentage from the field wasn't great, but he got to the line 11 times, mixed up his O, grabbed some tough boards, dished out four assists rotated well on D...he was essentially the anti-Bargs.

It's games like this that tease fans to death and he simply he needs to start playing this way on a consistent basis. Tonight he should be matched up against big men that are a lot less mobile than Noah and co, and the team needs him to take advantage once more.

3)  Lock-down the Perimeter.  The Suns without Amar'e don't do much of their damage in the paint anymore, but are absolutely deadly from outside.  They have one of the league's most efficient field goal percentages, best true shooting percentages, and are currently fifth in the league in terms of team 3-point percentage.

Tonight Toronto absolutely needs to keep the Suns' shooters in check, although some of this is predicated on stopping Steve Nash from getting wherever he wants on the court.  Calderon got lit up by Derrick Rose Wednesday night, but against Nash he should be able to hold his own a lot better.  DeRozan, Weems, Johnson, Barbosa...all need to be focussed on containing Phoenix's perimeter types in order to try and get a W.

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I really think we can still get kyrie..nbadraft.net has us picking him at number # 4. I just don’t see how he can go number # 1 with the time he has missed and a pretty serious injury too boot. Plus other players stock must be rising as well. We also got to think it depends on what teams that could be ahead of us in the draft need..like if the wolves pick ahead of us I don’t see them picking kyrie with the amount of PG’s they already have, same with the cavs they now have baron and sessions they don’t need a PG either. It should be intersting to see where we stand.

by sherwin316 on Feb 25, 2011 8:21 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

I’m starting to like the sound of Valanciunas – kinda the anti-Bargs himself.

by benjibopper on Feb 25, 2011 8:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Those are the two guys that interest me the most in this draft along with Terrence Jones. A top quality PG, an active big man with centre size and a defensive/rebounding mentality and a tough SF. Those are the Raps biggest holes, although James Johnson might lessen the need at SF if he keeps playing the way he did agaist the Bulls.

I think the Wolves and probably the Wizards might pass on Irving. I wouldn’t be so sure about Sacramento(Udrih) or Cleveland(Davis). It depends on whether they like a guy like Sullinger more than Irving, but if they don’t they will take Kyrie.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 9:37 AM EST up reply actions  

Cleveland has Sessions as well. They are pretty high on him. And Sacramento depends on whether they still want to try Evans at the 1 or 2, but they would probably take Irving.

Irving is ideal, Kanter or Valanciunas would be nice – Kanter if we draw the 5th pick, Valanciunas if we trade down. Wouldn’t mind Terrence Jones or Harrison Barnes at the 3, but I would prefer a point or a C if possible. Two hardest positions to find talent at (and two most important to a team’s defense).

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 10:21 AM EST up reply actions  

I hate the idea of taking Kanter. His game doesn’t impress me at all and I don’t think it fits in well with the direction that the Raptors are going. Perry Jones is another guy that I am scared might end up on the Raptors. He fits the Colangelo magic ratio of skills vs. size, but unless he can play the 3 I don’t want him anywhere near the Raptors. A cross between Charlie V and Marvin Williams, IMHO.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 10:39 AM EST up reply actions  

Kanter is a very strong, physical center who shoots inside and out, plays defense and rebounds. Isn’t he EXACTLY what the Raptors need?

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 2:22 PM EST up reply actions  

He is also slow, a bit short for a centre, his “wing span” is nothing special and he is not particularly athletic. I don’t think his game will translate well to the NBA. Perhaps I am wrong. If the Raps draft him then I hope to God that I am wrong!!

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 2:26 PM EST up reply actions  

I’d love to watch more of him (thanks, NCAA), but from what I’ve seen, he’s really not that slow or short. Apparently he’s 6’11 with a wingspan over 7 feet. Not great, but certainly not bad, either. I’d actually say he’s about average size for a center in the NBA today.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 2:32 PM EST up reply actions  

As I said, I don’t believe in the guy and wouldn’t want to draft him. I think his size is alright, but it certainly won’t give him any advantages especially since he is not a stellar athlete either. On the plus side, he is supposed to have good hands and a decent basketball IQ, so maybe he will turn out better than I expect.

A lot of people were skeptical of Kevin Love and then others were very high on Darko, so you never know. I personally would look elsewhere, but then again perhaps you are right and he is what the Raptors need.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 2:50 PM EST up reply actions  

“you are right and he is what the Raptors need.”

Exactly! What that so hard to say?

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 2:57 PM EST up reply actions  

What’s that? You “like taking quotes out of context”?

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions  

That bastard! Well, at least he’s admitting it.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 4:38 PM EST up reply actions  

No, unfortunately he’s not playing anywhere, at the moment. I’m hoping he catches on with someone so teams don’t have to base most of their decision on workouts.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 6:59 PM EST up reply actions  

no shortage of talent

at the PG position…. the league is a saturated with these guys. I mean some of the best PGs this league has ever seen can’t even make the all-star game now a days. (Nash and Kidd… maybe Parker, if only for his success) A guy like Ty Lawson, who I think is going to be a great PG, can’t get a chance because he is stuck behind a great in Billups….

The C on the other hand is and historically has been the toughest position to fill. Getting an adequate guy is not that difficult (Nazr, Dampier etc), but the team changers (Dwight, Shaq, Duncan) are such a rarity. However, when you do get one of these guys (and can keep them) your team is pretty much set to be playoff team for the next decade.

I’d still be happiest if the Raps took the best player available regardless of position… and then dealt with the roster from there. Its not like there isn’t a position we couldn’t use more help with (except maybe PF)

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 12:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Unfortunately, it looks like PF might be the position of strength in this draft, which kind of sucks.

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 1:27 PM EST up reply actions  

TIm Chisholm wrote a great piece on TSN.ca recently about the Colangelo and his “bad timing” and this draft is another case. Technically the ONLY spot on the floor they don’t need to address is at the 4, and this draft is chalk-full of solid ones.

That being said, I still think you take the best player and without the top pick overall, I think that means Raps fans should prepare for life without Irving.

For me that’s Sullinger right now.

I’ve watched him play a ton and he can come in and contribute right now. He’s huge, has an excellent low-post game, great hands, good basketball IQ, a winning mentality and can rebound like mad.

He doesn’t have Perry Jones III’s upside, but you combine the low-post dominance of Sullinger with the shot-blocking and raw athleticism of Ed Davis, and those are two really nice building blocks.

This is especially true if the Raps are dead set on keeping Bargs at the 5, because frankly Sullinger is a Kevin-Love-esque complement.

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 1:35 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree about Sullinger

and drafting the best player… but this team needs a SF for the future.

by Jenge on Feb 25, 2011 2:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Colangelo and his "bad timing" and this draft is another case

worst part though…. this was talked about last season. Hardly a suprise going in now.

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 2:39 PM EST up reply actions  

I will concede that Colangelo has had a bit of bad luck (i.e. getting the first overall draft pick in a draft with no true #1 draft talent) but he’s made his share of mistakes that can be attributed 100% to bad analysis/decision making. The bottom line is, you have to make the most of what the circumstances provide. I don’t believe BC has done that.

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 2:58 PM EST up reply actions  

The next piece of bad luck would be if the Johnson trade works out better than expected and the Raptors find themselves with a pick outside the top 5 this year.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 3:32 PM EST up reply actions  

ew: Johnson trade working out better then expected

If Johnson turns out better the expected, let’s say a legit starter rather then a rotation player that’s a net gain in my books.

1) It means that SF is a less pressing issue then it was going in. It also means that we need not acquire another SF as a temporary solution, knowing that Kleiza will eventually return to the fold the year after next. Enable us to focus resources on other areas.

2) It means that our roster will feel less unbalanced when we end up taking a pf in the draft.
In a draft that tilts so far towards PF, we would be lucky to draft a PG or SF who we feel is comparable in talent to the PF’s available (based on mock draft sites). It is much more likely that we draft a PF that will have to log some minutes at center, which isn’t uncommon especially for a non-playoff calibre squad like ours.

by Yardly on Feb 25, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Meant "re: " in title.

by Yardly on Feb 25, 2011 4:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Suppose trading for Johnson ends up being the difference between drafting Irving and drafting Kemba Walker as PG of the future. I don’t think it will come to that, but it would be another example of BC’s luck. In that case, maybe the Raptors ought to replace him just to improve their karma ;)

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 4:32 PM EST up reply actions  

My Top 5 for the Raptors

1. Irving
The point guard of the future the Raps clearly need

2. Sullinger
Kevin Love II

3. Valanciunas
A rebounding big with solid defensive skills fits the bill of ‘true center’

4. Kanter
Ditto above for Valanciunas

And then I think it gets scary.

5. Williams
He’s now higher on most draft boards than I have him (which is good!). The biggest weaknesses I see are that he appears to be a 4 trapped in a 3’s body, and that his game resembles Michael Beasley’s. Can he be converted to a 3? Can he defend any position at the next level? Do the Raps really need another pure offensive force next to Bargs?

The SF’s everyone is talking about; P.Jones, T.Jones and Barnes, are all pooped on by WOW metrics – and that makes me wary of considering any of them, though Perry Jones has some freakish athletic gifts that make him my favourite of the three if we absolutely have to take a small forward.

I’d love it if Freddette, Jackson or Holiday could slip to us in the 2nd as they have top 10 WOW scores but very low profiles draft wise (Fredette is the best bet to leap into the lower first round).

by CamHilton on Feb 25, 2011 4:09 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t know whether advanced stats do well when applied to freshman, as opposed to upperclassman who should have the whole NCAA thing figured out by now. Pretty sure there were a few metrics under which DeRozan seemed like a poor choice, Hollinger?

I agree with you on being wary of Williams. Players that try to make the switch from college 4 to NBA 3 always get my back up. Whether it was being really strong for their size (Joey Graham, PJ Tucker) or jump out of the gym athletic (Joe Alexander), the two positions stress different things, and they’ve missed out on years of position specific coaching and experience.

by Yardly on Feb 25, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions  

just out of curiosity

how well do WoW metrics translate to college ball? The work well in the NBA because it is (generally) very player centric. College ball on the other hand is very team oriented meaning stats are distributed much differently

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 4:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Are WOW metrics the number of times you say “Wow!” when watching a player? Okay, bad joke, but it had to be said.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 4:40 PM EST up reply actions  

everyone and their mother

wants Kyrie right now… whether thats the same at draft day is still to be seen.

But I’d also mention alot of teams are always willing to take the best player available regardless of position (the smart ones anyways). That player still tends to be much more valuable as an asset that someone who ‘fits’ better.

Cavs will want a PG (they need every position available). Baron is not staying long and won’t be built with. Sessions is a filler right now.

Without a number 1 pick this year… I just don’t see any guarantees.

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 9:42 AM EST up reply actions  

+1

At this point it is a crapshoot as to what will happen at the draft.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 9:45 AM EST up reply actions  

Crap Shoot

The sdds of rolling a seven or an eleven are 6:1

The current odds of the Raptors getting a winning player out of the 2011 draft are a hell of a lot better than 6:1

by Buddahfan on Feb 25, 2011 11:35 AM EST up reply actions  

good point

But I’m thinking baron is there for the long haul. Like why would the cavs trade month..(Who is a younger and cheaper contract version of baron) if they didn’t want him there for long? Unless they try and trade sessions cause barons contract is pretty big. I think the cavs will go a different. Route and choose someone else

by sherwin316 on Feb 25, 2011 10:25 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I would wager

they try to move Baron before Sessions (good luck with that)… but I just don’t see Sessions as their PG of the future either. They were only high on Sessions in so much as he was better than Mo (thats not saying alot).

I do think however that the deal is going to be a complete disaster for Cleveland

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 10:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Agree with NSFS

They will sour on B. Davis soon enough. He has a very consistent track record of wearing out his welcome.

Sessions is nice, but who in their right mind would pass on Irving in favour of making Sessions their PG of the future?

This deal, from Cleveland’s point of view, was all about adding a second lottery pick. Davis was the price they had to pay to make the deal. If they miss out on Irving maybe Kemba Walker becomes their PG of the future.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 10:42 AM EST up reply actions  

+1

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Chicago beats Miami last night

Go figure!
That number 3 pick could be optimistic. I think a few cellar dwellers wll give us a run for our low draft pick. Then we need the luck of the draw.
Here’s hoping we get top three but let’s not take it as a done deal.
On the fence regarding trade deadline. Was kinda hoping we could get something for Reggie’s contract. Guess there was no deal out there.
Think about it – nothing for both Peja’s or Reggie’s expiring deal.
Still got time to use the trade exemption, otherwise we get James Johnson for Chris Bosh!

by Tinmann on Feb 25, 2011 8:58 AM EST reply actions  

(Shudder)

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Not necessarily

There is a lottery. The odds are we would pick fifth but depending on how the ping pong balls bounce.

by Tinmann on Feb 25, 2011 9:18 AM EST up reply actions  

Of course. But he said ‘if the draft was today.’

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 9:18 AM EST up reply actions  

3rd most losses

The Raptors have the 3rd most losses right now, so I guess you could say they have the third lowest ceiling for wins right now. Of course, their competitors in the turtle derby could easily lose their “games in hand” and “catch up” to Toronto. As you guys said, it all depends on the lottery. Toronto could end up picking 8th under the worst case scenario right now.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 9:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Ladies and Gentlemen!

FANTANKING IS OFFICIALLY IN FULL EFFECT IN RAPTORS LAND!

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions  

Not sure I totally get your joke, but yes at this point I think tanking is the way to go this year. Too bad the draft isn’t better, but such is life.

Btw, I imagine the JJ adrenaline rush can’t last more than a few games and the Raptors will probably play .300 ball the rest of the season.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 10:46 AM EST up reply actions  

Based on the competitors’ winning percentage right now, it is much more likely that they lose those games in hand than win them.

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions  

Yes, you are probably right.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 10:47 AM EST up reply actions  

It’s still possible but improbable. The Kings might not have Evans for the rest of the season so I don’t see them winning many more games, and they’re the closest team to the Raps. Can’t see Minny or Cleveland going on any winning streaks so that leaves Washington…and they just moved one of their better player (Hinrich) for spare parts essentially…

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 1:38 PM EST up reply actions  

It’s possible that despite how bad the Raptors have been this year that they could end up with a pretty mediocre lottery pick. If the Raptors have no luck in the lottery and end up with say 6th overall pick, then that really bites…..

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Disapointed

I have to say, before the deadline I posted that we should be disapointed if we had nothing to show for Evans/Barbosa at the deadline. I’m disapointed. Not saying it is entirely BC’s fault (need two to tango) but surprised we couldn’t have gotten something for at least Barbosa…
As Tinmann astutely and humourously put it above, if nothing gets done with the TPE around draft time, we’re looking at James Johnson for Chris Bosh…. cricket…. cricket.

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 9:42 AM EST reply actions  

I just don't see many teams

interested in Barbossa. The only teams that would chase him would be contenders (everyone else is more or less in the playoffs by default and few are looking to take on more salary just to loose in the first round).

Each of those teams already have their instant offense guard off the bench… well maybe not Boston anymore (in Robinson) but as I understand it that was a real late deal.

Maybe… maybe… chicago would have made sense….

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 9:47 AM EST up reply actions  

Lakers – Brown

Heat – House

Magic – Reddick/Arenas

Spurs – never change anything to their rotation… and when they do its a slow slow process (but they do have Gary Neal and Hill)

Dallas – Terry

Atlanta – Crawford

OKC – Harden

Denver – everyone on their bench not named Birdman (stretch calling them contenders I know….)

not saying he isn’t necessarily better than some of these guys… but others already know their systems. Just can’t picture anyone else wanting a possible contract (I just don’t picture Barbossa not using his option as he won’t bring the $ he is getting now)

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 10:09 AM EST up reply actions  

All good examples.

You’re probably right. However, I think SA, LA and Heat would have been good homes for him as Barbosa is an upgrade over the incumbants. He may also fetch a better bounty in the off season (expiring).

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 10:32 AM EST up reply actions  

Agreed, I saw the Bulls as a possibility but that player option is definitely problematic. However for the chance to get rid of Hedo, I’m willing to let Barbosa stick around.

Again, though, BC put himself in a position not to have the assets to make key moves at the deadline…

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

“Again, though, BC put himself in a position not to have the assets to make key moves at the deadline…”

I can’t agree with this statement. Firstly, the James Johnson deal was basically a trade deadline move. It doesn’t have to be on actual day to qualify. Secondly, Reggie & Barbosa’s injuries this season were likely the biggest impediments to moving them. There isn’t much Colangelo can do about guys getting injured. Thirdly, the moves that the Raptors need to make to improve are going to come at the draft. Sure, it might have been nice to get an extra second round pick for Reggie or something minor like that. However, unless you think that some Sam Presti was just waiting by the phone praying that someone would call with an offer of Jose Calderon for Russell Westbrook, well what key moves did you have in mind?

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 2:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Well, James Johnson, Ajinca, and Bayless. Plus a non-lottery first rounder whenever we next make the playoffs. But your point stands on that one.

Why people expected moves at the deadline confuses me. Barbosa is hurt, so teams don’t want to take a chance on him, especially considering his big player option. There was a chance, but it was never great. Evans was always a 50-50 shot, with maybe a Thabeet-type package coming back, maybe a really low first-rounder or a 2nd rounder. Not surprised nothing happened, and cap space is always good to have – even if you can’t sign anyone with any tangible skill, it helps in trades as well.

Barbosa will be of more value at the draft and in the summer, when he will be an expiring, as well as hopefully healthy. Jose, Bargs, etc will all be easier to move after the end of the season, because they will have one less year on their overpaid deals. The TPE can be more easily utilized when the season ends as well, since there is no tax impact then (as it stands now, if the Raps had used the full TPE at the deadline, they would have been 8 million into the tax). Any impact moves were always going to come leading up to and at the draft, as well as in the summer (when BC usually does his work anyway).

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 10:33 AM EST up reply actions  

Shut Barbosa down

I believe he needs an operation on his wrist that was being put off. Why have him contribute to possible wins.
Barbosa’s expiring deal will be a lot more attractive at next years deadline.

by Tinmann on Feb 25, 2011 10:32 AM EST reply actions  

Agreed – heal him up NOW, so he might even be ready to be traded at the draft, in the summer, or next deadline. The more opportunities to dangle him, the better.

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions  

+2

For the good of all involved. Weems can get his minutes at the two and Bayless can backup Jose (assuming JB’s ankle is ok).

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 10:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah in my opinion, going forward, only the following guys should be getting minutes:

-Bargs (begrudgingly ha ha.)
-Johnson & Johnson
-Ed Lover
-Calderon (although I’d be capping his PT)
-Careless/Bayless
-W and W (Wright and Weems)
-DeRozan

Love to see Alabi, Ajinca and Dorsey in there somewhere but the reality is that their minutes would come at the expense of Bargs so I don’t see it happening, or Davis and Johnson, who need more PT than the aforementioned.

In a perfect world of tanking, the club would sit the vets quite a bit and treat the final 30 or so games as an extended pre-season so they TRULY know what they’ve got to work with going forward.

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 2:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, for the purposes of tanking the Raptors might want to send James Johnson down to Erie if he keeps playing like he did last game ;)

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed

And “ED Lover” = awesome

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 2:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Point taken...

But wouldn’t we want to showcase him a bit so he can be moved for more value in the offseason?

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 10:46 AM EST up reply actions  

Gotta get that surgery out of the way at some point – and waiting until the off-season might push his recovery past the start of next season, leaving only in-season trades. Plus, there’s always a chance he makes it worse by playing through it.

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 11:14 AM EST up reply actions  

Isn't it just an off-shooting-arm-wrist injury?

Which is usually no longer than an 8 week recovery (but I’m not a doctor). So why not play him into the ground (trading him anyways) pump his value and trade him in the offseason. Plus, not sure you can make a wrist injury worse, it’s not like it’s a knee or ancle (leg injury).

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 11:27 AM EST up reply actions  

Barbosa's Contract is Bit Complicated When It Comes To Trading Him

He has a player option for $7.6 million for 2011-12

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9165

He may choose not to exercise it in which case if the Raptors renounce their rights to him he is just gone.

However, my guess is that Barbosa will exercise the option. If he does then another team might be willing to trade for him after he exercises it.

At this point I can’t see a buyout happening with him

We shall see.

by Buddahfan on Feb 25, 2011 11:47 AM EST up reply actions  

Totally agree…think a buy-out will be the reality unless suddenly the Raps take a mega step forward next year and suddenly Barbosa becomes a useful spark off the bench.

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 2:16 PM EST up reply actions  

Or if they enter the offseason with a Barbosa shaped hole in their roster…say some team signs Weems and they have too few guards.

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 2:32 PM EST up reply actions  

On player development

 James Johnson had a good game last time out but all it will take is a bad game tonight and suddenly he’ll be a whipping boy here. I think Bayless and Weems have lots of potential and I believe if they fail to become better, it is as much on the coaching staff as it is on them. I have felt that Wright has done a pretty good job in the time he has gotten but probably has a personnality conflict with the coach so he remains glued to the bench. It apperas that Alibi has no future in the organization as well.
It seems that there is a real knack to developing young players and it is as much mental preparation as any thing. Toronto has no way to become competitive except to do a better job of developing the young players because they can’t buy players like Boston did, and Miami did and now New York has done. Even if the Raptor organization were willing to spend big to bring in a couple of stars, it is unlikely they would come.
So the future is not that promising in terms of championship but perhaps we may get to first round by developing. For those that pin their hopes on the draft pick, one only needs to look at the Wizzards and John Wall situation see that a star pick can’t do it alone.
So as Rap fans, the next 5 years or so are likely to be a series of challenges getting into the playoffs and then dealing with the money teams when we get there. It’s going to be tough.

by raptball on Feb 25, 2011 10:37 AM EST reply actions  

I think we gave a pretty realistic view of Johnson’s game and tempered our enthusiasm. So if he’s terrible tonight, I don’t think the “trade the bum” chants will be out in full effect.

But I totally agree with your development philosophy. BC HAS to be patient and keep building around the youngsters. It’s not going to be a fun ride as a fan, but hopefully Colangelo makes some savvy moves that turn things around in less than 5 years.

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions  

no fun for a fan? ...maybe

but for an analyst? …. this is more fertile ground than a chicken-egg wrapped in a cow-patty inside a comet headed for the centre of the universes donut hole….

or something like that…

by Jenge on Feb 25, 2011 6:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Jame's Johnson Iowa Energy Stats

Sorry if this is a double post.

He put up better D-League number than Davis and Alibi – LOL

Games 8
MPG 32.1
PPG 19.3
RPG 8.9
APG 4.3
BPG 2.5

FG% 53.5
FT% 91.8

Not very good at three point shooting though 17.6%

http://www.nba.com/dleague/playerfile/james_johnson/index.html?nav=page

by Buddahfan on Feb 25, 2011 11:28 AM EST reply actions  

Those are very good stats for the D-League. They don’t say how good he’ll be in the NBA, obviously, but it would be very troubling if he didn’t dominate down there.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Davis Didn't Dominate Down There

Both Davis and Johnson had two seasons in the ACC

Johnson did have one NBA season but it is what is which is very good.

I didn’t read you posting about how troubling it was that Davis didn’t dominate in the D-League.

If you did please provide the link.

by Buddahfan on Feb 25, 2011 5:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Davis averaged 10 points and 5 rebounds in 17.5 minutes of play. Did you watch the two games he played? He dominated. In fact I said so….
http://www.wearingfilm.com/picketfence/2010/11/ed-davis-come-on-er-up/

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 7:04 PM EST up reply actions  

James Johnson

Starting tonight, according to Koreen’s twitter.

Yay!

by dhackett1565 on Feb 25, 2011 1:51 PM EST reply actions  

You have to cheer though

Because starting him and then putting him on the bench after he played well is a classic Traingelo move…

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 2:25 PM EST up reply actions  

Perhaps they are stepping out of their usual routine. After the very mild benching that Bargnani received a couple of weeks ago, Triano decides to try the revolutionary move of starting the guys who played well in the last game. Maybe there is hope for him yet ;)

by DW19 on Feb 25, 2011 2:30 PM EST up reply actions  

COmpletely disagree that the Raptors should have tried to go after a veteran like Gerald Wallace. I would have called for Colangelo’s head if he did that. If you’re going to rebuild, then you have to go all out. You can’t chicken out and hedge your bets. Every move Oklahoma makes I like them more and more. They waited until the right time to add a veteran and he was exactly what they needed.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 2:27 PM EST reply actions  

nothing better than

making that move that lets you draft a top player in the league…. sucking for a while and then getting lucky in the draft year and draft balls. Skilled move.

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 2:42 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the point is, you stick with sucking until you have amassed enough young assets through the draft (and free agency) and when the team is positioned to take that next step, strike for that veteran asset that puts you over the top. This was excecuted to perfection by OKC.
Draft/aquire Durant, Ibaka, Westbrook, Harden, Green, Sephalosha then trade one of those stockpiled assets to fill a specific need, thereby moving your team to the next level. THAT’s how you build a winner. But yes, point taken, you do need those picks to pan out.

by MAS11 on Feb 25, 2011 3:04 PM EST up reply actions  

LARGE Caveat

We don’t know about Harden yet, but overall OKC is batting about .900 via the draft, something VERY few teams do.

So sure, a club like the Clippers (I’m talking the pre-Griffin version) can have a lottery pick every year, even multiple ones, and still make the wrong decisions and never amass enough talent.

That’s why this draft is so big for BC…

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 3:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Ya, it appears the drafting of Cole Aldrich was their only big mistake, in the draft. I actually didn’t think Aldrich would be a bad pick (and it’s still too early to make any rush to judgements), but I felt that they’d regret passing on Ed Davis. As a Raptor fan, I’m forever grateful they did.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 3:31 PM EST up reply actions  

you know

I watched his very first game with OKC and he looked extremely good. Although I have no idea what happened from there. I was just thinking yesterday ‘what the hell happened to him’.

by Not so Friendly Stranger on Feb 25, 2011 3:34 PM EST up reply actions  

re: Aldrich

He was billed as a bigman who didn’t have a high ceiling, but was a guy that would have a ten year career in the league. Since he was more of a bruiser then a scorer, is the price paid for kendrick perkins an indication that he wasn’t as ready to contribute in the short term as OKC thought? Because they seem to be in the same class of bigman, and usually the backup would bring some different wrinkle the second unit.

by Yardly on Feb 25, 2011 5:31 PM EST up reply actions  

The role of Conservatism in drafting trends

I would add that OKC usually opts for players with longer track records or a more mature game. for their highest selection. Westbrook was finishing a junior season, as was Jeff Green and Cole Aldrich. And James Harden was a sophmore. Durant and Harden were examples of players who had a well rounded cluster of wing skills right off the bat, no issues with dribbling or shooting. They have balanced this by taking the odd hack at a high upside unknown like Serge Ibaka and more recently BJ Mullens. Not all of their lower picks pan out, but stakes in terms of salary are much lower.

While the jury is still out on Harden being a good pick relative to what was available, he was never in danger of being dropped after his rookie deal. DeRozan had alot more skills to refine and develop on the fly, thus he was a much bigger risk. Kind of falls into BC’s strategy of trying to make up for lost ground by going double or nothing on the next hand. It opens up the chance to dig yourself quite a hole when you can’t at least salvage something from prior moves that were all or nothing (ie JO, Hedo )

by Yardly on Feb 25, 2011 5:39 PM EST up reply actions  

Hey, don’t discount the importance of luck. San Antonio owes several Championships to landing Tim Duncan. And Oklahoma is on the verge of becoming a great team because they got the second pick and Portland took the guy who was falling apart.

by Tim W. on Feb 25, 2011 2:56 PM EST reply actions  

+1

See previous comment.

Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com

by Adam Francis on Feb 25, 2011 3:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Really enjoyed the discussions today; lots of valid points abt the state of the raps. I personally accept where the team is and think BC has done a good job of positioning himself to improve the team. The summer will be filled with decisions beginning with the draft. Irving, Barnes, Sullinger and Terrence Jones are my picks. I don’t believe in Perry Jones at all and Derrick Williams will be a good player but not great so no need to draft another PF unless he’s gonna be much better than who we have. Enes Kanter needs to play in the NCAA and do well before I become a believer in him. Barnes is the guy I really want if Irving is gone. I think Barnes is a good, smart, well rounded player who reminds me of a better (more skilled) version of Demar Derozan when he came out of college. I would love to see him and DD on the wings for us for yrs to come.

I don’t think BC has to fill positions at PG,SF&C all this summer. Hopefully this draft will fill one of those positions and next draft another one of those positions with a free agent signing or trade somewhere in between to fill the 3rd position. I don’t see this team being competitive for another 2 to 3 drafts and that’s if the draft picks actually work out for us.

Hopefully tho we can see some exciting and competitive basketball the rest of the season. Also want to see if J Johnson will fizzle out like Bayless did or if he’s consistent with his level of play. Hopefully Bayless is just going thru a rough patch and will bounce back but lately he’s been looking like pretty bad out there. Would like to see him improve and get aggressive again.

by Member29 on Feb 25, 2011 4:48 PM EST reply actions  

So we know where we sit until the end of the season pretty much…

A few very minor questions linger…

 

Will Barbosa get surgery…

Will Ajinca get useful minutes…

Who the hell stole Bargnani’s jersey and played against Chicago…

 

But we more or less can foresee the rest of the season.

 

Knowing what we know, this is my take on how the Raps should finish out the season.

 

Starters

8 Jose Calderon G 6-3 210

10 DeMar DeRozan G 6-7 220

0 James Johnson SF 6-9 220

32 Ed Davis PF 6-10 225

7 Andrea Bargnani C-PF 7-0 250

 

Bench (in order of entering the game, not necessarily minutes usage)

15 Amir Johnson PF 6-9 210

24 Sonny Weems SF 6-6 203

32 Jerryd Bayless G 6-3 200

00 Alexis Ajinca C 7-2 248

28 Leandro Barbosa G 6-3 202

14 Julian Wright SF 6-8 225

09 Joey Dorsey PF-C 6-8 268

30 Reggie Evans PF 6-8 245

50 Solomon Alabi C 7-1 251

Injured

11 Linas Kleiza SF 6-8 245

 

Starters Strategy:

Jose is our number one PG, no question he is required for heavy minutes…

Demar is our future All Star at the 2…

Johnson is a good all around player with a defense first mindset, best option to start at SF until we draft Terrence Jones, Harrison Barnes or Derrick Williams…

Ed Davis continues to add to the defensive balance this starting lineup needs…

Bargnani (love it or hate it) will start as long as he is a Raptor…

 

Substitutions:

1. Whichever of Davis or Bargnani is having the worse start, Amir replaces… If he comes in for a struggling Bargnani I also substitute Weems for James Johnson to maintain scoring…

2. When Jose needs a rest I bring in Bayless…

3. When Demar needs a rest I move Sonny to the 2 and bring James Johnson back into the SF spot…

*When Bayless is at the helm I would like to run a lineup of DeMar or Sonny at the 2 (whichever is in at the time), James Johnson at SF, Ed Davis at the 4 and Ajinca at C… Rationale-Bayless and DeRozan/Weems can attack, while the other three crash HEAVY on the boards…

I would sprinkle in minor minutes for Barbosa if he doesn’t go for the surgery, and very minor minutes for Wright, Dorsey and Evans until all these guys are traded…

 

 

Interesting side note: In numerous games now I’ve watched how well Jose and Amir work together, it’s beautiful, but also that Bayless has been quite willing to look for Davis and Ajinca when given the opportunity…

 

 

Anyways… that’s my bit of coaching for the day…

KDFREATPED

by Mikthaniel on Feb 25, 2011 5:08 PM EST reply actions  

If Jose had better shot selection and played even average defense I would like him a whole lot more.

by EdDames on Feb 25, 2011 5:52 PM EST up reply actions  

GO SUNS..!

OPPS wrong site

Never Fear. Grant Hill is Here.

by sun_equalizer on Feb 25, 2011 5:16 PM EST reply actions  

Im craving for Barbosa

His quickness is surely miss by Suns

Never Fear. Grant Hill is Here.

by sun_equalizer on Feb 25, 2011 5:18 PM EST up reply actions  

You can have him back for cheap...

How about Dudley? I hear nobody in Phoenix likes him anyway… LOL

KDFREATPED

by Mikthaniel on Feb 25, 2011 5:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Dudley is good on twitter

but he forgets how to make 3’s after he signed his huge contract

Never Fear. Grant Hill is Here.

by sun_equalizer on Feb 25, 2011 5:20 PM EST up reply actions  

no way

Childress is the future. currently injured and just no room for him at the moment, but when Ghill finally retire, he will be our starting 3.

Never Fear. Grant Hill is Here.

by sun_equalizer on Feb 25, 2011 5:24 PM EST up reply actions  

The Thunder Won Only 23 Games Two Seasons Ago

Yes they had a skinny kid who could shoot named Durant who has since gotten a lot stronger.

The Raptors are on the right track.

by Buddahfan on Feb 25, 2011 5:52 PM EST reply actions  

Who Goofed I Got to Know?

Must be some legal contractual deal.

Signed into NBA Broadband Access to watch the Raptors – Suns game and I got the Suns announcers.

Well, at least it will be interesting to get the viewpoint of an opponent’s announcers.

by Buddahfan on Feb 25, 2011 7:05 PM EST reply actions  

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