Sunday Thought - Should the Raptors be Making a Play for Fernandez?
Rudy Fernandez has been doing a good job lately of wearing out his welcome in Portland...but should Toronto be looking to acquire his services?
Sometimes in the NBA, the best trades are the ones that aren't made.
Early in the off-season, a large rumour was floating around the NBA draft, that the Toronto Raptors were looking to acquire Portland Trailblazer forward Rudy Fernandez in exchange for a package that would include the Raps' lottery pick.
Whether this was an actual deal that was on the table or not, no one knows for sure.
And even if it was, it never came to fruition.
Maybe Toronto thought Portland was asking too much, and maybe Portland was leery of letting a proven talent go for a roll of the dice draft pick, no matter what the lottery positioning dictated.
Again, who knows.
However, while the rumours surrounding Toronto's interest in Rudy have died down, Mr. Fernandez hasn't been any less of an off-season topic of discussion.
Earlier in the week his agent went public with a quasi trade demand, going as far as saying that Fernandez would sit out the next two seasons on his contract if need be, so he could return to Europe afterwards. The result of this outburst was a nice fine thanks to Mr. Stern, but in any event, it's obvious that his time in Portland is coming to a close. Add in the fact that the Blazers drafted two swingmen types this summer, signed Wes Matthews, and look to have a healthy Brandon Roy and Nicolas Batum returning, and even if Rudy did make peace with the Blazers, there isn't exactly a ton of playing time now for him.
Cue the low-ball offers.
While the Knicks reportedly have offered a swingman of their own, Wilson Chandler, in return for Fernandez's services, I'm guessing there have been several other much less savory offers sent Portland's way.
So should Toronto be sending an offer of their own? After all, the Raptors apparently did want to get in on the Rudy action earlier in the summer apparently, could use some more depth at the 3, and of course, love their foreign players.
Strictly from a financial standpoint, a deal for Rudy is quite possible, it just depends what Portland is looking for. If they're just looking to move the disgruntled Spaniard without taking on any future contractual commitments, a simple move like this could work.
Or if the Blazers want to make things a bit bigger, and clear room for some of their youngsters, maybe something like this.
Now admittedly both seem unlikely because of the lack of talent Portland gets in return, so if Rudy goes, maybe DeRozan or Weems has to go to the Blazers in exchange, who knows.
As well, because "Traded Player Exceptions" can be broken into pieces under the CBA, the large exception obtained via the Bosh deal could be used in part to sign Fernandez, negating the worry about sending a contract (or contracts) of equal size back to Portland.
But more to the point, should Bryan Colangelo be even entertaining notions of trading for Rudy?
On the pro side, we're talking about a very athletic 24 year old who's shown in the past that he can light it up at a moment's notice thanks to his wide array of offensive skills. When he was drafted by Phoenix and subsequently acquired by Portland, everyone expected him to be the next big European star.
However through two seasons, he's looked more like Joey Graham than Drazen Petrovic, especially during the times he should have had plenty of opportunity to step up.
Best example? - Last year during Portland's playoff race. With Roy out for six games, Fernandez averaged only 8 points and shot only 37 per cent from the field. And because he's never been known as a defensive stopper, when his offense goes...well...
Sound familiar?
Toronto currently has enough players who fit this mould as is so you can understand why I'm hesitant about them bringing in another.
And looking at the advanced metrics regarding Rudy, the picture doesn't get much rosier.
Last year's numbers represented a major drop-off from his rookie season, even though he played only about two less minutes a game on average, and had a very similar usage rate. His win score dropped from 6.1 to 3, and his PER dropped from a league average mark of about 15 to 13.1.
The cause of the drop? Primarily it was Rudy's shooting.
Since the 2008-09 season, only Desmond Mason had a poorer shooting percentage from 2-point range, outside the basket area. Last year Fernandez struggled in the same way, and while he still hit 3's at a good clip (37%), it was still down from his 40% mark in his rookie year.
He simply wasn't as efficient a scorer, and again, considering he got to the line less than twice a game and didn't contribute much in any other area (2.7 rebounds on average and 2 assists), this pulled everything down. To emphasize the point, Fernandez's defensive win score dropped only from 1.8 to 1.6 but his offensive win score fell from 4.3 to 1.4.
So what does all of this say?
Well to me it says buyer beware if you're a Raptors' fan. Fernandez seems a bit too Marco Belinelli for my liking and his skill sets simply don't do enough to complement the current group of players to make this a home-run acquisition. I'd go as far in fact as to say that he's a bit like Carlos Delfino light; both can fill it up on O and are extremely streaky shooting-wise, but Delfino rebounds and defends. In fact both had very similar seasons statistically outside of the latter two areas as you can see here.
Of course it really all depends on what Portland wanted in return for Rudy right?
If suddenly the Blazers throw out an offer like the ones outlined above well...
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Ya i agree with you
we should get rudy if the blazers just want to offload him but then again i bet they got alot offers like the one you suggested so they probably want some talent in return
by raptors_run_the_show on Aug 22, 2010 10:31 AM EDT reply actions
No thanks
Don’t need him. At whose expense will his minutes come from. And if he doesn’t get the minutes, he has already proven in Portland to be an attitude problem. At least Beli was never an issue publicly whining about his minutes. If he was a better defender, I would say take a flyer. But he’s not.
Just to play devil’s advocate – what if all Portland wanted was Joey Dorsey? Or what if they were willing to give up one of their youngsters or Pryzbilla?
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Aug 22, 2010 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you made you a pretty powerful case above. Why take on another player who is supposed to be an offensive player, but isn’t that good/reliable offensively, and doesn’t play defense or do anything else particularily well. Besides, after Turkaglu, I’ve had my fill of malcontent Euros who think they are better than they actually are.
I see your point, taking on potential and giving up basically nothing. However, I would rather give those minutes to a Weems/DeRozan combo at the wing (which I believe can work at times based on match-ups) and/or Julian Wright, who at least plays defense.
especially
if you have to give up a borderline hall of fame lile Joey Dorsey….
Seriously
the point is more like: can he play the 3? can he shoot for midrange? One overlooked problem of this seaon is the Raps are a team with a lot less talent in the post and, at the same time, has a starting 5 that cannot open the box shooting.. witht he exception of….. the starting C…. this team, as it is now, it is a true mental masturbation…….
He can always be flipped, you know. Plus, if Barbosa gets moved at the trade deadline to a contender looking for scoring, some minutes at the 2 and 3 should open up – especially if Wright disappoints.
by dhackett1565 on Aug 23, 2010 8:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Sure about that are you? Anyway, I voted no, because I think the same way – but for those who are voting ‘Yes, if the price isn’t too high,’ then with the assumption they don’t ask for those players, my above statement holds.
by dhackett1565 on Aug 23, 2010 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions
this team, as it is now, it is a true mental masturbation…….
With so many young and unproven players I think this is a very fitting quote – very hard to get a read on things.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Aug 23, 2010 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions
agree with MAS11 & CMRM123
i wouldnt go for him..theres no minutes availabe..we just got rid of marco why would we bring in another player who is very similar in more ways than one? i much rather give those minutes to weems & derozan cause at least when their on the court together than play well.
and like cmrm123 stated if rudy doesnt get his minutes he starts complaining..we dont need that kind of attitude on this team right now.
Rudy is quite taller than Marco
so he may be able to play the 3 where Marco could not
Rudy, like Marco needs to play consistent minutes to be effective, but is a key member of Spain’s National team, and with Raptors he is not going to play ahead of DeRozan and Barbosa, so is superflous, as was Marco.
Belinelli with Italia at Eurobasket, 6gms, 32mins, 15.8pts, 4rbs, 3.7asts, 1.8stls, starting every game.
For interests sake Bargnani 6gms, 30mins, 22.5pts, 7rbs, 2.2blks, playing @ center, second in scoring, first in blocks in tourney, and leading Italy to 3-3 record, after 0-2 start.
For interest US vs Spain exibition game is on Rapt TV at 3pm today.
Thanks for the info on the US game Johnn19!
Setting PVR now…
im watching it now
GARBAJOSE!!!! good to see him play again
agreed
watching the first half and rubio is gonna be a star in the nba for sure..his defence is pretty good, can get in the lane with ease and his passing is amazing..it was a few weeks ago on here one of readers said there was a rumour that rubio wants to play in toronto ( dont know where he heard it from) i cant remember who on here said it but if its true if im BC id be calling kahn everyday to try and get this kid on the raps..oh and rudy is playing horrible.
it was a rare moment when most of the Euro haters from TO took a breather
by renato on Aug 22, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, where did they all the Euro haters come from this past year or so.
Seems like they live in Buffalo not Toronto.
by Bathurst St. on Aug 22, 2010 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I am coming to Europe to drive a steak through your heart (and yes I am using the wrong spelling intentionally).
well as long as you do not cut my neck
who gives?
Ricky Rubio has brought Rose down to earth
Actually Rose is digging now….
Ouch Calderon hamstring injury... again
left the game….
Rudy & Jose
Pre-Wright, I might’ve thought about Rudy Fernandez.
Post-Wright, I just don’t see the advantage. And like a number of posters, it has the makings of being detrimental to the development of this team.
- Not enough minutes to go around – in a pinch, Weems could fill in (for SF injury issues)
- Rudy`s defensive shortcomings (we have enough of them).
Jose – Hamstring injury (again) or not, I think this is why I believe JC needs to move on, even though I`ve always been a supporter. His belief in Toronto, and enthusiasm, is more than can be said for a number of players who`ve graced a Raptor uniform. For that reason, I find it difficult to see him move on.
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You mentioned Demar or Sonny, as possible trade material for Rudy – a thought that would make me choke (should it ever come to fruition). A trade of this nature would not only affect my faith in the current Raptor direction, but it has so much potential to destroy the camaraderie developing within this team – a camaraderie I didn`t see enough of last year.
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No matter who gets added to this team (in the future), I would hope that the immediate goal is to develop the young part of this team. As well as guys like Bargnani and Jack.
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The minutes available for the upcoming season, are precious tools. Using them right is the key to success – and hopefully that success takes us further than before.
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He actually doesn’t even jump all that well. But he has long arms!!!!
by dhackett1565 on Aug 23, 2010 8:15 AM EDT up reply actions
no to fernandez
not that hes a bad player
but no time to go around especially if we are really focusing on developing derozan and weems. he doesnt add a new skill to this team and we do need defense and rebounding more, hes got an atitude, portland seems to be asking for a lot from other teams when fernandez is basically forcing his team to trade him, and if we do trade for him were giving away expiring contracts at a time when were rebuilding. now i dont know when fernandez’s contract ends or even pryzbilla (if he is indeed added in a trade) but i just dont think its necessary to add fernandez (who has the same skill set as every other raptor). i think if this team is serious about the future, theyd just let derozan and weems fight for sg mins and even sf if needed and let this team grow together while still being in the lottery. im already looking forward to seeing kyrie irving or harrison barnes here next year, and the season hasnt even started.
so wheres the option:
“Right…like we need another white, defensively challenged, soft, guard…”
I've often thought of becoming a golf club
at the moment, behind Kleiza
we got a black basketball challanged jumpoveryourheadbutcannotdoanythingelse, which, by the way you articulate, must be part of your connection.
whos white?
If your talking bout Rudy sorry but he’s Spanish.
by sherwin316 on Aug 23, 2010 6:50 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Around these here parts, it’s a black and white world, now ain’t it.
by dhackett1565 on Aug 23, 2010 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions
please indugle me
are you implying that “Spanish” is one of the variation of grey standing between white and black?
Let's forget about Fernandez for a second and ask a much more interesting question
Should the Raptors be going after JR Smith. He is an expiring contract who could be an impact player on this team. If the price was right (say Evans or Banks and David Anderson) is he worth pursuing?
hmmmm
You know what that’s an interesting thing to think about..Jr can be a game changer alone and is an expiring contract. But the thing with him he’s a massive head case..do we really want someone like that in the locker room full of young players? That’s the reason most of us here are a lil hesitate to bring in rudy or tj…I like the idea cause of what Jr brings skill wise but would he be a bad influence to a young team?
by sherwin316 on Aug 23, 2010 8:02 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Apparently the Young Guns hung out with him at some point – there have been references from him calling them his homeboys or some such. Too early for me to remember properly.
by dhackett1565 on Aug 23, 2010 8:18 AM EDT up reply actions
JR Smith
is still a chucker. Extrememly streaky and, as was mentioned, a bit of a headcase (well maybe more than a bit). He defense is as suspect as Fernadez.
Really all you are getting is the ‘North American’ version of Rudy.
by Not so Friendly Stranger on Aug 23, 2010 8:25 AM EDT up reply actions
No that’s correct – JR and Weems in particular are tight from their time together in Denver…which gives Weems’ agent nightmares I’d bet based on the description he gave me of the circus in Denver while Sonny was there.
I like JR’s skills, but hearing Weems’ agent tell me horror story after horror story (George Karl doesn’t even talk to him – an assistant addresses Smith) about him makes me say thanks but no thanks.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Aug 23, 2010 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions
werent you against trading for gilbert arenas?
why would you trade for J.r smith and not try to trade for Gilbert instead. both are head cases but gilbert is a better player. I think denver would want significant talent back for j.r smith anyway.
by raptors_run_the_show on Aug 23, 2010 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions
I guess the main difference in the two is Jr is an expiring contract where as gilbert contract is pretty huge.
by sherwin316 on Aug 23, 2010 8:44 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
More Rudy
For those who watched the game yesterday between Spain and the US, you saw the issues with Rudy that I described in yesterday’s post. More from Jason Quick on it:
http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/2010/08/a_fitting_end_to_a_chance_to_b.html
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
Anyone have a link to the Jose injury?
Wanted to discuss this morning but haven’t seen anything official in the news despite seeing what looked like Jose hobbling off…
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
This is another reason to trade jose if we can..just a few years ago he was a borderline allstar..since than for the life of me he can’t seem to stay healthy. Its just troubling to see.
by sherwin316 on Aug 23, 2010 8:46 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Unfortunately...
This recent injury just makes it more difficult to trade him. GM’s are asking the same questions you are regarding his durability.
I believe you did not watch the game
And I believe that journalist didn’t either. In the last possession, Team USA changed defense to zone and got the spaniards by surprise. Rudy took a prayer shot with 3 on the clock out of a broken play. That particular play did not add anything to the discussion.
The game was, instead much more of a testament to the difference there is already between Jose and Rubio.
link
or
I love how we debated whether JC was injury prone a year ago: http://www.raptorshq.com/2009/7/15/949732/the-value-of-jarrett-jack#18240928
Great find Ustation – reading the comments is cracking me up. Lots of folks arguing that he wasn’t injury prone at that point in time…and maybe he wasn’t “technically”…but he was obviously fragile to a certain extent.
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Aug 23, 2010 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Jose's Injury
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=tsn-166203
“Calderon struggled against Team USA before injuring his hamstring in the second half. Calderon was 0-for-5 from the field and finished scoreless. Calderon registered a 20 in +/ compared to a +19 from Ricky Rubio(notes), who came off the bench and helped spark Spain’s comeback.”
I don’t think it would have been possible for Jose to have a worse game.
Absolutely not to a trade for Rudy Fernandez. He has none of the qualities that we need and Portland has already turned down mid to high first round draft picks for him. If BC makes a play for him I will jump out this 9th floor window.
Bargs to Minnesota for Rubio anyone?? I would do it.
Please don’t jump.
Although I’ll jump with you if BC moves Andrea to Minny for Rubio and pieces (to make the deal work financially.)
It would be a “jump of joy.”
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Aug 23, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Spain vs. US game yesterday
I saw most of game except for the 3rd and early 4th (fell asleep). But from what I saw, Ricky Rubio is ready for the NBA. He needs to put on some weight, but skillwise his game reminds me of Jason Kidd.
Jose was playing terrible before he got hurt at the end of the game. Spain may be better off from his injury if it means more minutes for Rubio.
Unless Kevin Durant plays out of his mind in the World Championships, the US aren’t winning gold. If Spain shoots half-decently in the game yesterday, they win handily.
I think Rudy Fernandez is ideal as a scorer off the bench for a team that is planning on contending. He’s very good in transition and you can run him off screens and curls in the half-court. I just think he’d be wasted here. On last year’s team he would have been a much better fit. This year, we are rebuilding and while Fernandez isn’t old, he’s not a guy that needs to be in a rebuilding situation. He’d be a great fit in Boston.
Jose was terrible. I watched the game and felt sick to my stomach seeing his game and thinking about that as part of the Raptors core next season…and that was before the injury!
Adam Francis - Publisher - RaptorsHQ.com
by Adam Francis on Aug 23, 2010 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions













