Looking to the Phoenix Suns to Rebuild the Toronto Raptors

A lot of teams are going to be kicking themselves this offseason as they had the opportunity to make a move for some of the Suns players at the beginning of the year only to balk at the cost that they would now gladly pay (I am looking at the Miami heat who decided not to part with Beasley).
I think Bosh is gone and that creates a host of problems for this team and the scenario you are painting.

1. - If Bargnani (10 mil/) is your Channing Frye, who is your Jarron Collins? With no Bosh and no Bargnani in the starting lineup, how do you get any production out of your front court?
2. - Who is your Nash? Right now neither Jack nor Calderon even come close to matching his production. Without a PG there is no point in having a discussion about moving to a Phoenix/Oklahoma style team.
3. - Who is your Grant Hill? Sure Turk can handle Hills offensive duties but we all know what his defense is like. Hill is still a very good perimeter defender. Turk, not so much.
4. - Who is your Jason Richardson? Richardson was over paid by GS and got moved around before ending up with Phoenix. Even the Suns were looking to unload his salary at the beginning of the year before they decided not to blow the team up and start over. Right now Weems seems like the most likely candidate but it is not certain.
5. Even if you sign 2 of the guys you mention bringing in, that still leaves a very weak overall team. There are only two blueprints to win a championship in the NBA that have worked. Have one Superstar paired with an All-star caliber player then round out your team with role players or have 5 star players as your starters which allows you to have a decent bench to back them up. Phoenix has the superstar (Nash) mixed with an all-star caliber player (Amare) and they have a lot of nice pieces, especially in the front court where they have gotten ridiculous production from guys most people were wash outs (Dudley, Collins, Frye etc). They have a future replacement guard in Dragic and guy who can score off the bench in Barbosa. We are at least 2 or 3 years away from accumulating those kind of assets. I think we need to start from scratch. Take a year to suck it up and get no worse than a 4th overall pick (hopefully better) and move forward from there. It is difficult to see this team staying together and having any success.

I hold a different veiw though, if you look at the championship teams over the last 20 years, there is a pattern there. I think it is to build by position.
The center position on those teams has seldom been all star quality, Parish, Cartwright, Lambeer and recently Perkins.etc. but they were excellent post defenders and rebounders.
The point guard needs to solid defensively and have the ability to score only when the others can’t get it going, Denis Johnson, Harper (with Jordon), Isaiha Thomas, Tony Parker and recently Rondo.
The 2 and 3 positions are where the super star must be, Jordon, Kobe, Bird, and recently James. One of these positions must be the “go to” scorer cabable of shooting threes, mid-range and driving. Ideally the other should be a lock down defender Bowen, Artest, Pippen and Anthony Parker (Cleavland)
The 4 spot needs to be a post scorer and rebounder,Duncan, Gasol, McHale etc.

This seems to be a tried and true formula.

So the Raps.
At the “point” are in need of improvement defensively, Jack seems to be able to penatrate but has a way to go.
At the center, they require a defensive rebounding center which they don’t have.
At the 4, Bargs could fill this role if coached properly especially where he can step out for the 3 pointer,
At the 2 or 3, the Raps have no star of any kind. Weems and Derozen will improve but to the level of a Wade or Bryant or Peirce??? Probably not

Have a look at how he has been performing in the last few years. Maybe sometimes chaning and tradin is a crapshoot? Reality is noone saw this coming and sometimes things work irrespecting to how much one screw it up and sometimes things do not irrespective to howmuch the overall vision seemed to make sense.

Point in case, I still believe the Raps should have won 50 games this year, and I still believe Kerr is a lucky sucker…. feel free to disagree…….

Great post Franchise, I have some points to add though… First off, it’s hard to compare any team to the Pheonix Suns because Steve Nash is such a singularly transcendent talent. I’m not sure I’m sold that this Raptors roster can be retooled with "singles" and "bunts" if CB4 signs elsewhere. If CB4 does leave we have the majority of the cap still tied to Turk, Calderone and Bargs. Turk, in my opinion, may just be washed up – incapable of ever reaching the heights he did two years ago in Orlando. Oh and a complete defensive liability. Calderone is what he is. A decent offensive PG that may have lost a step and is a complete defensive liability.

That brings us to Bargani. Your statistical comparison to Fry above is truly frightening. You asked two questions above that are both interesting, and both have the same answer: "In fact, is there really much difference between Frye and Bargs?" and "So why not use Andrea in a similar fashion?". The answer to these two questions is: Andrea’s contract. While they both produce similar numbers, Bargs has a $50 mil deal which ironically, is why BC would never allow him to come off the bench (and bruise both his reputation and ego at the same time).

If this team try’s to retool on the fly around Turk and Bargs (and maybe Calderone) the results will be a middle of the road team with a first round play-off win as a maximum ceiling. Therefore, in my opinion, because of the position BC has put himself and this franchise in, it’s either blow this puppy up and rebuild or swing for the fences. In the NBA you are either selling hope, or selling wins. Hope being the rebuilding process. I would be happy with either, even if that meant putting up with a few stinky years at this point. However, I see no hope and an unacceptable amount of wins in a team lead by Bargani, Turk and Calderone.

If Phoenix should make it to the NBA Finals, and Nash keeps playing as he does … win or lose, that’s a play-off MVP guy. For my money, Steve Nash is a pure pleasure to watch. He embodies everything that an MVP should have – ability, toughness, leadership & civility. LeBron may have the first three, but he lacks the fourth. Most of all, Nash makes everyone around him so much better.
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Which brings me to Channing Frye. I like his style, but reality check needs to take into account the Steve Nash factor. What kind of numbers would Andrea pull down if he had Nash tossing to him? Comparing numbers is tough under these circumstances. As for the per 36, I’ll keep saying this … Per 36 is an over-rated stat (and useless in my books).
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I do like a hybrid OKC / Phoenix plan – add some more young guns, a few veterans, and see where it goes. For next season, all I want from the Raptors is to make the play-offs, and not much more (sans Bosh). Should BC take this approach, play-off experience would be the next step in the Raptors evolutionary process.
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[" Take Andrea Bargnani" …. (Starter or Bench?) … "In fact, is there really much difference between Frye and Bargs? "]
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I think there’s a difference. Bargnani actually played close to the 36 minute mark. Frye (with one extra year under his belt) did not. Until Channing plays that much, you can’t truly compare them. Never-the-less, Andrea’s Offensive rebounding average is higher (1.4 to Frye’s 1.1) on your per 36 ticker. In this year’s play-offs, Frye is only .5 (per 36 adjusted).
Why do I bring this up? It’s because I value the O-Rb stat more than total rebounds. With Bargs, he has a habit of "being too nice" and relinquishing uncontested defensive rebounds.
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A lot of numbers do compare (again with the per 36). With the exception of FT attempts & makes.
Andrea (80 starts): 181/234 (2.92 per game)
Frye (41 starts): 98/121 —> 127/157 (1.94 – adjusted to Bargnani’s 35 min)
In these play-offs, Channing has a total of 9 FT attempts, in 10 games = .9 FTA average.
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We complain that Andrea doesn’t rebound enough, and doesn’t get to the Free throw line enough, but Frye is not an upgrade. We expect more from Bargnani (and we should), but I still believe his upside is still “an upside”, and his rebounding numbers will pick up, as will his drives to the basket (and subsequent free throw situations).
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As for Hedo, I do agree that the Raptors need to allow him to roam more often. I think that’ll be a function of moving one PG in the off-season … Jose being the logical choice.
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If Bosh leaves, I don’t see myself as disappointed. Maybe it’s what the Raptors need. A bit of a fresh start, a younger team (Weems, Amir hopefully, Bargs, DeRozan, and Jack), plus a coach who hopefully has gained some experience. Find a real “defensive guru”, and who knows where the Raps can go.
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Copying the Suns in nothing new and part of the reason BC got the job, after the abysmal job done by Rob Babcock (e.g. Vince Carter for a case of Labatt).
But no team has ever succeeded without an All Star or two, and Phoenix is no different – at its core, Phoenix has a volatile PF named Amare, a great veteran in Grant Hill, and one of the best PGs of all time.
When (not if) Bosh leaves, BC has to bring in a marquee player if he wants to see the postseason again. It doesn’t have to be Kobe or Wade, but without a true captain, this ship will go down.
One option could be a S&T deal sending Bosh back to Texas in exchange for Dirk – botyh teams need a restart and this could be just what the doctor ordered. A good draft pick and some solid role players are important, but a team needs a main component beofre it can start building.