But for God’s sake. If this ONE performance is a testament of what this team value is sans Chris, does it mean that all equally bad performances with Chris on the floor are a testament of him being an inept player? (John Cage says: Pleease)

In relation to get another reliable and consistent go to option, well they do not grow on threes, so you either buy one (free agency) or you make an investment to grow one. On the latter I would say this team has not made any investment on Andrea (since you mentioned his name) . You want to get consistency, you need to provide consistent touches. Chris has grown to his level by playing for years with mediocre versions of this team where he has been given the opportunity to fail and grow (speaking as being the primary option). That said I do not think yesterday performance as being indicative of this team value. It was a dreadful game where the Raps came out utterly flat and cocky. Just look at the turnovers which are not affected by the presence of Chris. Probably with Chris this would have been a W no matter what, just because Portland plaid almost just as bad.

It is on Jay’s shoulders to enforce some sense of offensive discipline on this team. One of the things I enjoyed last night was watching Portland run disciplined offensive sets. Attacking certain players and sticking to the game plan. The Raptors, not so much. It appears that free lancing is the teams MO.

Also, your thoughts on Andrea are just hyperbole, seeing what you want to see to satisfy you own ego it seems. The kid is 24 yrs old and does more for this team than any other player outside of Chris Bosh. If Bosh leaves Andrea will fill his role. It may be rough at times, as it was with Bosh learning what he can and cannot do on the court, but in the end Andrea will rise up to the challenge.

Also, Jose Calderon is garbage. Fire him already. And fire Jay as well, he is being severely out coached and doesn’t appear to have any control over this team. I mean how many time does it take Jose trying to do a pick and role with Reggie before you lose it and sit his ass on the bench. It is also telling that Jay has to call a time out in order to get Andrea the ball, bust some heads Jay or GTFO.

Don’t really agree with even flow saying jose is GARBAGE.he’s done a great job in the second unit and cause of 1 bad game he’s garbage? This is why jay said when either evans or amir are on the floor bosh or andrea has to be there cause seein both of them together last night just doesn’t work.missing gimmies around the basket was just retarded but I guess jay doesn’t want to extend andrea too much or else worrying about burning him out.some of those turnovers last night were just sloppy and careless like as if these guys never played with each other before or something.last nights game was the perfect example if why this team NEEDS to resign bosh

Contrary to some who question whether Bargs and CB4 can play together, I think that over time, they have learned to compliment each other. Yes Andrea is better when he has the defense focussed on Bosh. I also think that Andrea’s ability to stretch a defence creates matchup problems and makes it harder for defences to collapse on Bosh. The key though is still Bosh who must be resigned. Andrea is at his best when he is scoring in the flow of the game as opposed to when he is trying to force things as the go to guy.

This is ridiculous. You’re giving too much weight to these last 3 games in order to predict the hypothetical situation of Bosh leaving. I agree with you, he is the MVP of this team and it will be dire to lose him. But the team would not look like it did last night, because evidently it would not play in the same style, and players will have had time to prepare and adjust to their roles.

For example, Bargnani. It’s clear he doesn’t respond well to change, as we’ve seen his struggles coming to a new country, new league, and especially the inconsistency of smitch in defining his role. Yet he has flourished since Triano gave him the starting 5 spot, and he’s found ways to improve the weaker areas of his game (defence, attacking the basket, communication). The same can be said for Turk, who struggled at the beginning of his tenure in both SAC and ORL, but flourished toward the end, when the team had solidified and he was a central figure.

This is typically the difference with Euro players. They perform better in a team situation, and therefore need to feel each other out, build trust and carve out habits. Contrary to North American players who tend to focus on individuality and independence from their teammates. You can trace this back to cultural differences as a whole, and it’s quite obvious.

for me im just excited if we can have these player in their primes in the next 3-5 years
bosh – 25
derozan -20
weems -23
johnson – 22
jack -25
andrea – 25
w/ some tweaks in the lineup other than these guys we will be finally contending for a championship in the next few years _

LaMarcus Aldridge didn’t do much last night and Andrea was the one who was covering him. I suppose it’s about reputation. Kevin Garnett can put up similar numbers to what Andrea did last night and be lauded for a solid game. I kind of expected this sort of post in response to last night. They simply didn’t play like the Raptors, it was as if they were the ones on the second game of back to back and the only concern I draw from this is what this might mean in a playoff situation when there are days between games.

Here’s one question I have about the rotation. Why isn’t Amir Johnson starting alongside Andrea when that has shown to be a very reliable combination that works on both ends of the floor? When word came down that Rasho would be starting, I worried because it would mean Andrea would be playing the 4.

With Rasho starting this team has a more “conventional” makeup to it which negates many of its advantages. It would be okay if it had very reliable 2-guard play but it doesn’t at the moment. Bargs doesn’t have as much of an advantage over most of other 4s he’d be facing, at least not initially until he adjusted to the position.

Also, Triano’s management of his rotations is still questionable at times. Amir & Reggie should NEVER be on the floor together.

What was up with Calderon yesterday? Maybe he and Rudy placed a collective wager on the Trailblazers winning by a certain margin.

let’s not forget we had to go through a couple of seasons these past few years of watching bosh learn how to be ‘the go to guy’. learning what to do with doubles, (first jersey playoff series,) learning how to attack quickly and decisively by way of reading the defense quicker, (him holding on to the ball and jab stepping for what felt like minutes, wasn’t fun,) incorporating a right hand finish, getting bigger and stronger, etc.

what we’re seeing now with bosh is the product of years of work as the ‘go to guy’. i.e. lots of touches. and I think it’s fair to say that bosh started with way more of a base in terms of the short game under the basket than bargs did.

all this to say that bargs has been learning, in my estimation, at a ridiculously fast pace if you consider everything he’s had to learn these past few years. being a ‘go to guy’ is the next step. I say he’s right on pace.

Bosh

Bosh must be re-signed.

Having said that, I don’t think you can say last night’s team is the one we will "be cheering for for the next three or four years."

First of all, your theory assumes that Bosh will be replaced by no one (or no one of substance). In reality, if Bosh doesn’t come back, we’ll get another impact player. We’re talking about BC, not Rob B. Having a Stoudemire or a Lee on our team will make us much better than last nights version.

Secondly, even assuming we get 2 Aarons and a big Z who is going to retire only to rejoin the Cavs, the current team is constructed around Bosh. If Bosh does not return, there will re-tooling of the current roster. In BC I trust.

Thirdly, even assuming we get the exact same team back minus Bosh. The team will develop plays for the existing guys and have time to practice them. The reason we are seeing such an ineffective squad lately is because players are playing a different roll and trying to run plays not designed for them. Hence the turnovers.

Hedo

I’m glad to see Hedo continue on his roll.

these are the type of performances I expected when BC made him his coup de grace this past offseason.

Wow, lofty expectations. Maybe that’s the root of the problem in your disdain for Hedo, you expect too much. Hedo was 8-9 from the field, 3-3 3pt and 5-6 FT. These are the performances you expect for $9M? I shudder to think what your expectations would be of Bosh when he signs a max deal. There is no question that Hedo underperformed to start this season. But his performance over the past 5 games (not 3 and yes I am giving him a bye for the first game back from his mom’s health issues) have been exactly what we need and would easily justify his contract. If he can continue (which I have all confidence that he can) at this pace for the rest of the season, I think we got what we paid for.

DD

I’ve defended DD in the past as someone who has developed nicely without really hurting the team. Last night, he hurt the team. We simply can’t have only 2 shots (both misses) from our starting SG. The whole point of the position is to shot. Hence the name. DD in the starting lineup works because the offence isn’t centred around our guards. But with Bosh out of the game, the SG position isn’t sheltered anymore. It can’t be a learning experience. We need some O from that spot. Maybe Belinelli would be better off starting at the 2 when Bosh is out. Maybe that’s what he needs to get out of his slump.

Back to Bosh

If Bosh can go tomorrow, why wasn’t he in yesterday? I think this team has a habbit of coddling its players a bit too much. It’s a fine line as you clearly don’t want to risk further injury. However, come on. Walk it off! Players of NBA old would laugh at the current "injury" wows in the league. You see Kobe play through all kinds of injuries. Wade has been out there playing through dislocations, broken bones and other ailments. The team needs Bosh and it’s time for him to step up.

one way that i see them not handling DD correctly is not playing him crucial minutes in the 4th quarters specially if he’s playing good ball early in the season. It’s like they programmed him to play & start 1st & 3rd quarter and that’s it … regardless if he’s playing well or not . I thinks it is delaying his maturity, confidence & development.

[" … last night’s version of the Toronto Raptors unfortunately seemed to bear an eerie semblance to what this club could look like next season should Chris Bosh depart. " ]

No disrespect, but I find this argument irrational. I realize the operative words are "what this club could look like", but in the end, someone will replace Bosh. Granted, the big question is: What kind of quality? We can look into that proverbial Crystal Ball, and come up with a myriad of options, but one of them will not be like the Portland game sans Bosh – with Rasho as our starting Centre. Nor Reggie, nor ‘Not Right Now’ Amir.

One of the problems with staking out the Raptor future is the intricacies of the CBA and the convoluted Cap crap. Knowing that BC has a special guy in his ranks, makes me feel better about resolving any difficult scenarios associated with the Cap.

As for Andrea – he is not the Number 1 guy. And he may never be. But he can be that quality 2nd option that teams need if they hope to go further into the play-offs. Bosh will always be the go-to guy if he stays. If he doesn’t, we need to balance his offensive output, as well as his rebounding prowess, amongst other players. And that’s not necessarily someone with near offensive numbers like Bosh’s. A quality defensive specialist will not score as much, but neither will the other team. Remember we still have issues in this area (Bosh is no exception), and when it comes to our play-off fortunes, this monkey on our back may haunt us till next year.

If next year sees our 3 ‘top’ Bigs as Bargs, Evans, & Johnson, then yes, we are truly f**ked. That said, a decent Centre/Power Forward should be able to provide 14 & 8 (Pts & Rebounds). What Bosh’s absence illustrates, is that we need more than one scoring Big to be successful.

Our issues tend to be more about the 2 and 3 positions, and having one of the lowest returns amongst the NBA. Hedo needs to step it up, with or without Bosh on the team – no way we make it deep into the play-offs with Turk wishing he was relaxing on the couch eating pizza. And while I like DeRozan, he’s a rookie who’s been thrown into the frying pan – he needs to pick up his socks, or Jay needs to find Antoine more often. I’m indifferent about him starting – saw too many Leaf prospects make it big elsewhere. That tends to cloud my judgment.

When it comes to Franchise players, if you take away Dirk, Lebron, Wade, Carmello, or any number of other guys, the team may pull out a win unexpectedly, but they will surely not make it to the end. Same goes for Toronto, although I can’t put Bosh in the same crowd as the 4 guys I mentioned. He’ll get his MAX dollars like them – just not with the same returns.

Bottom line is, I don’t fret about losing Bosh. If we get absolutely ZERO for a replacement, then I’ll be concerned. Until then, I like knowing that we could’ve won this game, had we not committed so many unforced turnovers, had Andrea made more of his shots (with more of that Italian fire going), had Reggie not played so much, had DeRozan not gotten a better line than 2 pts, 2 rebounds, 2 assists. Or had the Bench come through for us – as they have in the past. This game didn’t so much illustrate how things would be like without Bosh, but more how we can lose a game if WE DON’T TRY.

One other thing – NO WAY Andrea is Joey 3.0
.

calm down folks Bosh is not going anywhere. But having Turk find away to be as productive as he is without Bosh and the continued resurgence of Bargs the Raps front line is pretty good and this will be proven in the playoffs. I myself hate all this useless speculation that is posted here. I totally agree with Franchise and I myself cant understand these Raps fans that feel this team can survive without CB4. The Raps will be a lottery team without Bosh, and all you fans that thinks Bosh is not a max player because he doesn’t make players around him better, well take a look at Bargs production since Bosh injury, the Raps need Bosh, what the Raps doesn’t need is fans like you guys.

If the 2006 draft were re-done would Andrea Bargnani go ahead of LaMarcus Aldridge?

If Raptors had played the Nets and the Wiz with the same offensive game they would have lost both games. The Blazers game was a disaster, no one could make a shot or hang on to the ball, one to be forgotten as a trend or indication of anything but a poor offensive game.

They allowed 101, 104, 89 pts and scored 87, 109, 106 points, won 2 lost 1, leave it at that. After 20 straight 100 plus avg 107 pts they were due for a stinker.

Without Bosh they need contributions from everyone to make up his impact, and vs the Nets and Wiz they got them, but not vs the Blazers.

Rasho, DeRozan, Wright, Belinelli, Calderon, Evans, Weems, scored a combined total of 20 points. Those 7 of 11 who played for Rap’s were covered by Rudy with 17 pts off the Blazers bench.

With that kind of offensive contribution from the team I would expect them to lose 100% of the games that they play with Bosh out right now.

lets hope demar becomes a beast or we sign john wall