Tip-In: Toronto Raptors Post Game – Hustle and Flow

by RaptorsHQ - Archives on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST

How good would this guy look in a Raptors' jersey?

Blow the whole damn thing up.

If you saw last night’s game against the Chicago Bulls, even if it was the abridged "Game in an Hour" version via Raptors TV, it’s quite possible that you expressed these sentiments at some point during the contest.

I don’t blame you.

After watching the Toronto Raptors go almost toe-to-toe with the defending champion Boston Celtics on Monday night, only hours after a heroic comeback against the same champs, you had to expect a lot more than the effort that was put forth against the Bulls. Here was a club in disarray as Howland put it yesterday, one that has struggled with injuries and chemistry issues all year, and one that had recently been beaten by the seven victory Oklahoma City Thunder. Yet it was also a team that out-worked Toronto early on in this affair, and one that used some beautiful passing and offensive spacing to simply obliterate the Raptors offensively.

Prior to last night’s game, I caught legendary coach Bob Knight on ESPN discussing spacing in college ball, and how my own Duke Blue Devils were the top college team in the nation at committing to this theorem on the offensive end. Knight walked through various video examples of Duke creating space for teammates allowing room to operate, and the resulting offensive efficiencies derived from these decisions.

Watching Chicago last night perform surgery on Toronto’s defense by creating said spacing brought me back to Coack Knight’s early breakdown, and how it really all starts from the application of a simple principle – knowing your players’ strengths.

That’s exactly what the Bulls did in their victory last night as players like Derrick Rose and Luol Deng were featured constantly in mismatches while others such as Andres Nocioni and Kirk Hinrich were given openings to fire away from long-range.

Time after time, the Bulls forced bigger Raptor defenders like Chris Bosh and Andrea Bargnani onto the explosive Rose who would get to the hoop at will, or simply force rotations and find the open man. In fact, even though Rose had a monster game (25 points and 10 assists), the entire Bulls team looked for the open teammate all night and finished with an astounding 33 assists on 40 made field goals!

It’s tough to be more efficient than that.
Bulls’ coach Vinny Del Negro had his players cycling the rock from side-to-side and had I not been a Raptors’ fan, it would have been a thing of beauty to behold from a basketball purist’s standpoint. Many have knocked Del Negro for the job he’s done so far this season, myself included, but last night you saw perhaps just why he was Bulls’ management’s final selection. It wasn’t very complex offensive orchestration, it was simply taking advantage of Derrick Rose’s advantage over anyone who tried to contain him, and then going from there. Del Negro said as much post-game and admitted that this was something they were really able to do now with some healthy bodies back (Deng, Hinrich, etc.)

Yet even with all of this praise for the Bulls’ O-Game, Toronto still was within a blocked Chris Bosh jumper with less than 10 seconds to play in terms of tying the game and sending it to OT.
Toronto was down early in this one, fought back, and then rode a career game from Andrea Bargnani and a hot third quarter from Chris Bosh to even take the lead.

However down the stretch, the Bulls were the tougher and more determined team, and unlike the recent loss to the Bucks, it’s hard to argue that Toronto let this one slip away; the truth is that they never really deserved to be in it from the jump. As much as the Boston games showed just how good this team can be, last night’s loss to Chicago was a perfect example of why this club desperately still needs to plug a number of holes talent-wise, and again needs a major dose of grit and stoutness.

And if you come out with as little energy or attitude as the Dinos did yesterday evening, it’s hard to say that you should be a playoff team.

Look at it this way.

The Raptors reach the mid-point of their season Friday night against the Pacers in game number 41. Yes they’ve played a tough schedule and have battled key injuries, but they also only have 16 wins to show for.

Bryan Colangelo pre-season talked about this being the best Raptors’ team he’s had and yet the club is essentially on pace to win 32 games – not exactly top of the pops is it?

Maybe things would have been a lot different had the Raps had the services of O’Neal and Calderon for more of these matches and perhaps if they return healthy in the next few days (something that’s been alluded to although you won’t catch me holding my breath) the team can still make a run. Even last night against an undersized Bulls team I’m confident O’Neal would have made a huge difference. Maybe then Luol Deng wouldn’t have grabbed three straight offensive rebounds while the rest of the Raptors stood and watched in awe (one of the most frustrating sequences I’ve seen all season as an aside.)

And while Rose might have eaten Jose for breakfast, perhaps the offence would have been more efficient on Toronto’s side as well and players like Graham, Kapono, and Hump would have gotten some easier looks.

That’s a lot of conjecture however and the fact of the matter is that those two weren’t present last night or for various other matches and Toronto is stuck with the current batch of healthy players. This has unfortunately left Raptor fans viewing a team with some nice offensive flair at times, but very little substance in terms of grit and determination.

Jamario Moon is probably the player who best sums up this Raptors’ club in a nutshell. Here is a player blessed with all the athletic talent in the world but one who attempts some of the most ridiculous circus shots in order to avoid contact. He’s a player who looks from afar like someone who would be a deadly weapon in transition…that is until you saw him staring at the ball, head down like a 3rd Grader, while dribbling on the break. In fact, he’s a player who’s become quite adept at using his length and quickness to create space in order to shoot a jump shot.

He’s a walking contradiction and he’s not the only one like this on Toronto. In fact it was hard for me not to look across the floor at various Bulls (Deng, Nocioni, Thomas etc) and imagine them in a Raptors jersey. These two teams have what each other needs to a certain extent and I’m sure if you could combine them and keep the top 12 guys, you’d have a heck of an NBA squad.

I’m not sure how many players you’d keep from the Raptors’ bench though in this "combo-squad."

Again last night they essentially brought nothing to the table and left me wondering what a stat like "total bench points" would look like for the Dinos so far this season compared to other clubs. I think it’s safe to say that Toronto would be near the bottom of the league.

However as tempting as it is to completely eviscerate this team after last night’s morose performance, there were some bright spots during the loss.

The Solar Flare?

Well that had to be Andrea Bargnani who pumped in a game-high 31 points, grabbed 10 boards, including 3 on the offensive glass, and got to the line 10 times making nine. If you were skeptical about the Dirk comparisons and the big kid’s future, last night was all you needed to see. The best part about Andrea’s performance was that he only made two 3’s in this 31 with the rest a complete mix of inside and outside, mid-range and around the basket. And yet even in this 31 you could see that he’s quite capable of more once his low-post game becomes more refined.

And maybe that’s why this loss was even more disheartening.

To get a combined 54 points from your two "bigs," an efficient 15 from your starting shooting guard and yet still lose really hurts. It speaks volumes too I think of your club’s defence, and execution as well in key moments.

And while it won’t show up on the stat sheet, I think this game also gave yet another example of the unfortunate malaise that’s plagued this club for years; a lack of consistent effort. I’ve argued for a while now that the club needs an injection of talent but in addition, it needs players who go full-out for 48 minutes. How else can you explain the fact that the Bulls had all 12 of their offensive rebounds in the first half and once Jay Triano addressed this to start the second, Chicago got nary a peep at a second-chance for the rest of the match?

That folks is effort and desire and on this night, much like many others, the Dinos didn’t bring for a sustained period of time.
Chicago did, and they were lead by a future star whose "grit and persistence cup" runneth over.

All you needed to do was look at the play Rose made with 3 minutes left in the game. Rose helped dissuade a Will Solomon lay-up attempt at one end and then jogged up the court looking for the pass. As soon as he got it, he exploded into a sprint to the rim, laying it in. On the replay, you could see in Rose’s eyes how badly he wanted the pass and that he knew he could score.

It’s a look rarely seen on the faces of the Raps, and its absence probably does a better job than any stat of explaining why this team has only 16 notches in the W category this season.

FRANCHISE

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Comments

It is extremely frustrating to watch this team (or read stat lines as I do not have TSN2) play and continue to lose constant and not wonder what the heck BC is doing right now. I know that making a trade in today's NBA is hard but I cannot believe that he cannot find someone looking to dump salary (Portland, OKC) or make changes if even for the sake of change (Chicago, Washington). Even if Oneal and Calderon come back there is no guarantee that the team will start winning as Calderon has not played up to expectations this year and Oneal is just another big who will eat into Bargnani's minutes (and thus his stat line). If they wait until the Trade deadline it will be too late for them to make a move to make the playoffs and as I have already stated, I do not trust BC right now to draft us the help this team needs especially in the low teen range that this team is shooting for right now).

by McGateway on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

A raptor is an attacking, vicious creature that takes no
prisoners. Is there anything
less raptor-like than this team?
Guess how many free throws Solomon, Parker, Graham, Hump,Ukic, Kapono & Voskuhl took as a team? None Zero Nada.Do they even know how to draw a foul? - Not if you are
afraid of body contact.How about a hard foul on the Bulls? Nope - they only shot 15 of them. One by the slashing Mr. Rose who had a dozen free runs to the basket in the 4th alone.
I put forth that it is time for a change. A change of name, that is. I suggest the Toronto Pillows. Soft, cuddly
and used to put us asleep.

by Old Joe on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

how's this for unintentional comedy: the current poll question at raptors.com is 'which wing player has impressed you the most so far?' hahahaha.

by benjibopper on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Where did Colangelo go? I don't even hear from this idiot anymore. I guess he's happy with one of the worst teams in the league.

Blame it on injuries? Please. O'Neal is our only defender, but while he was around we certainly weren't winning more games. And Calderon looks like he needs to be taken out back and shot--slow and lame.

Most of the time I would want a horrible, pathetic, lazy, terrible team like this to tank, but it's not worth it with a dreadful 2009 draft class and no contracts of note coming off the books. Face it, you're looking at the 2009-10 Raptors right now, if Colangelo doesn't come down from his golden throne in the near future and recognize his failures of the past and move on.

by Aaron on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I can't believe you pulled out the heart and desire thing again, because I think we've been seeing a lion's share of that lately. Being a good ball-handler is a talent, bball iq is a talent, driving to the rim is a talent and frankly guys like moon, solomon, and ukic don't have defensive talent to even slow down a guy like rose - it's been our problem for a few years now, even though mopete, garbo and delfino may have been slightly better than our current crew.

Every other point you make are excellent ones in my opinion, but I see these guys playing hard, playing their game(s) and just needing lucky breaks to win. It's a problem that can only be overcome with talent.

This has to be the most dissapointing game of the season for me because playoffs chances are slim to say the least.

Even a trade is not going to help now... though if calderon could get back, you never know...

by axl on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

This still all comes back to unrealistic expectations. This isn't hindsight for me, but lets step back a little bit and go back to when some thought this was a 50 win team. What reasons did anyone have to think that except for hype? As a guy who owned O'Neal for the last 3 seasons in his Fantasy pool, maybe I had better insight, but there was no was going to impact this team the way some of the beat writers were predicting. Correct me if I'm wrong most notable publications had the raps at .500.

Having said that, I'd say I'm pretty happy that the Raps have been playing so well with 2 of their big 3 missing! Remember a few seasons back when this team was down to 7 or 8 active players (ala missing VC for the long stretch) and the team just tanked. I'd say this team has played much better than anticipated through this stretch.

I've always been a big proponent of matching big 3s to predict results and when you think of the Raps right now its Bosh, Barg and ? This just goes to show you how well Bargs has played during this stretch and that's a huge bonus.

I'm no offensive guru, but I think this team relies too much on iso plays(ie feeding bosh/the bigs in the post and letting them work). We're not a drive and kick kind of team, but how about going to 1-4 set or 1-3-1 running more movement and back door run offs? If I could I'd like to see Moon/Kap set high pick and rolls with Moon slipping and Kap popping - with the bigs on the off side. If the guard beats pick and you get weak side help, the bigs are open and should be on a mismatch. If D plays tight and Moon slips he should an easy drive. If it's Kap he steps back and gets an open look. If the guard doesn't get the drive, kicks to Parker where they run the high screen again on the other side and try again.

Or maybe go to the Princeton offense -- actually that'd really be the perfect system for this team! Everyone's a shooter, but empahsis is on the backdoor first until they pack the paint.

Any coaches out there?

by ustation on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I think the fact of the matter is, no matter what we say about not having the defense, the concern has got to be on the offensive side for this team. To not be able to hit 100 pts with Bargnani making 31 of your points is just impossibly frustrating.

by Vicious D on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I never thought this was a 50 win team but I thought they were at least a 41 win team and a playoff team. This couldn't be further from the truth however as this team is too good to tank and too bad to compete with anyone playing decent basketball. BC no longer has a choice. He has to make a move.

by McGateway on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Realistically I think this game may be on of the last nails in the playoff coffin. We need to take the positives from this season and begin surrounding them with complementary pieces. Bargs and Bosh have shown that they can be the 4/5 combination we envisioned them being. Calderon is a servicable PG. From there it gets sketchy.

Without a player who can dribble penetrate it leaves the opposing teams to play their man. There's no disruptive force in our offence. Look at what teams with Allen, Pierce, Rose, Roy, Cavs, Lakers, Nets do to our defence when you have a guy that can cause defences to over help/rotate. Sigh...

Also the whole summer of 2010 is pointless for us. With the entire NBA having clear cap space that year, it's the raps who are going to have trouble drawing players. I think we need to move JO for contracts expiring this summer and build the team on the free agent class of 2009. I think that includes, Dirk, Artest among others.

by j on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Glad i missed this one thanks to rogers - probably worst loss of the year on paper.

I too think effort plays a huge part here - how else do you explain almost beating the celtics twice and then losing to this bulls team with no real bigs???

Old joe - love hte raptors compare, youre bang on.

by fromlongrange on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

The reason BC can't make a trade is no one wants the players on the raptors outside of bosh, calderone and bargs. If the Raps want to have a good team next year They should keep these players, play JO sparingly, tank the season, get a good really good lottery pick 1 to 3 and next year they would be better, then come 2010 resign Bosh, get some really good players from free agency and we will be a contender in the East for sure. No need to squeeze into the playoff this year with these guys and lose a good draft pick....We are only 2 players away from a very good team.

by RAPS4LIFE on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Wathching these friggin raptor games are making me crazy. Yes, Moon truly sums up this team's defects -- lazy, scared, and inept! When Moon chucks the ball I feel like reaching in and slapping the crap out of him, and throwing his lazy ass in the paint where it belongs... pussy!

by georgioh on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

This loss stings.

I have an observation/question I want to bounce off everyone with respect to Bosh. And please don't mis-interpret this as Bosh hating... I love Bosh.... but I've noticed he just doesn't seem to be a 'game winning shot' kind of guy. Am I having a brain fart on that subject? Am I wrong? The other night when Bargs hit the game tying 3 it got me to remembering back when Bargs used to come in the 4th quarter with ice in his veins and light it up.

Does Bosh have the 'game winning shot' kind of skill or does he lose it mentally as the clock winds down in the 4th? I'm having a hard time remembering him hitting a game winner.

Anyone?

by mcclarky on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Im a big raptors fan,its really hard to watch these guys play,im tired of making excuse for this team to my friends,this is simply unacceptable, something must be done as soon as possible,its really fustrating watching these guys play,its obvious we dont have much talent at certain position,that need to be addressed BC cant afford to sit and wait any longer.

by moe on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Great post Old Joe – this team is the antithesis of a Raptor…right now they’re more like one of those dumb, pea brained sized herbivores that looked menacing but had little bite. I’m going to go with the Stegosaurus.

I didn’t want to have a 10 page recap but unfortunately I have to admit that this was the first game this season that really made me worry about the franchise’s future. Yes, maybe getting ahead of myself but really, and as Aaron put it, this could be next year's team we're looking at too. How exactly again is that supposed to convince Bosh to stick around?

I worry that BC needs to pull something out of his hat here because next off-season, barring a JO or other big salary clearing deal, there just isn't going to be the financial room to snag anyone who can put this team over the top. That means Bosh is left with a club that at best gives him a 40 win season I think.

I'm not counting on the draft either, even if the team does end up in the lottery. A) I don't trust BC's draft skills and B) I don't think there's a player in this draft outside of the top 3 who can make a serious impact on this club next season.

Ideally, I'd like to see BC go for broke here and try to clear space for this summer. If you haven't read it yet, TNT's David Aldridge does a nice job of summarizing why that might be a better play for many teams:

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/01/08/aldridge.dose.090107/index.html

I'm still not sure there are a ton of players that would be huge upgrades individually - but maybe a number of guys in the Nocioni range of talent, and the next big step from Andrea, will get the job done.

It's tough though as in the next 18 months or so we could witness a fall from grace of epic proportions for Bryan Colangelo if he fails to keep Bosh and suddenly in 2010 we're looking at a line-up of Bargs, Calderon...and...that's about it.

PS - Hate talking so far into the future but like I said, last night's loss had to make you say "uh oh" a bit. Like J mentioned, we might be looking back in May at this game as being the final nail in the coffin.

by Franchise on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Mcclarky,

You’ve got a point, but read what Doug Smith wrote in his blog today… Makes pretty good sense:

"Go try to find another NBA team that, with the game in the balance and a basket a must, that would ask its power forward to create a play. Can’t find one in my feeble mind because it’s always, always, always a guard or a small forward. Would Boston put the ball in Garnett’s hands? No way. San Antonio for Duncan? I don’t even think he was on the court when Roger Mason beat the Lakers last night. Utah and a healthy Boozer? Not a chance. Any team? Anyone? Nope.
And that’s the fatal flaw of this roster.
Maybe – maybe – they would run a screen and roll with Jose if he’s in the game but even then I doubt it.
There are simply no creators on that roster and the GM has to address that need."

Moe,

You bring up an interesting point… Last night I remember thinking to myself "I hate these guys". Now, this was in the first quarter and was probably an overreaction. However, I must admit, it’s a labour of love to watch this team. It has become tedious. Essentially, at its heart, this is a jump shooting team. I hate jump shooting teams, because they only win when someone becomes hot from the field or collectively their jumpshots fall. They don’t attack or put pressure on their opponent. Top that off with the fact that this version of the Raptors is weak, doesn’t posses any sense of toughness or pride (defensively and offensively) and it makes for a tough team to support night in and night out… I don’t know how much more I can watch… Even last night I found myself flipping back and forth between the game and the LOST reruns…

by MAS on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

MAS - Interesting point, I struggle to "like" the players on this team at times too, even Bosh. And it stems directly from their lack of aggression offensively. Like you said, it's just very hard to be enamored with a jump shooting team.

Also - the Portland situation with Darius Miles could end up working in Toronto's favor. If Portland is desperate to get under the cap over the next few years, I wonder if they'd move LaFrentz's expiring deal, Channing Frye (who's not playing anyways and who would be a nice big for TO off the bench) and Travis Outlaw (the real target, for O'Neal and Moon?

Works financially and would still give Toronto a big chunk of change with which to breathe in 2010.

Talent-wise it's lopsided for TO but considering that Portland has Bayless, Fernandez and others waiting in the wings, they can afford to do this for the future.

Plus O'Neal makes a pretty good tutor for Oden.

by Franchise on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Okay, I put a little more thought into the whole Princeton idea. A few e-mails fired off back and forth between a few of us (lucky to have a few hoop coaches amongst the circle), and I think we're all in consensus that the system makes perfect sense, especially when Jose is not in the game.

Ideally they could run two sets, one with and one without Jose, but the Princeton is too complex for that and its a bit of the all or nothing approach. We don't think Jose's a great half court guy anyways, so this would still work.

This team has enough folks who can dribble/pass left & right. It's a matter of constant motion - 'specially for Moon/Graham types and the back up guards.

So forget the technical bit.. which coach is on the market right now? Eddie Jordan, who was an assistant coach in Sac at the time with Pete Carril - the Princeton Offence Guru!

Maybe the off season rehaul is to bring in Eddie, have Carril as an advisor and bring in maybe long time Hoya coach John Thompson (who played under Carril)as an Assistant?

The timing couldn't be any better, and the right personnel is out there.

We were getting more and more excited about the possibility as we exchanged e-mails. The system is great for Bosh/Bargs at 5, provided they're willing to see their numbers drop.

It's a deep draft this year, so I'm okay with them tanking, since they weren't going to compete for the finals anyways.

Bring in a new staff after the all-star break, and start working on the new system.

BC! Can you hear me?!?!?!? Do it! DO IT!

by ustation on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

mcclarky unfortunately the answer is a big fat NO..Bosh is not a game winning shot taking player. I have yet to see him hit a walk off basket(like they say in baseball)If the coach calls the last play for Bosh and the shot is not there he still takes the shot which makes me wonder about his basket ball IQ even the great ones when its not there they dish it off to an open player (ala Jorden/Kerr)several times Bosh has been double triple team and he still try to take the last shot mean while Kapono, Parker or Bargs has a way better look. Bosh is a very good player but not a go to guy in crunch time to answer your question mcclarky but that is just my opinion I am sure there or others who would beg to differ but I am yet to see Bosh win a game in the final seconds since he has been here.

by RAPS4LIFE on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

oh and I'd make a play for Lamar Odom this summer. He's getting misused in the Laker system now. Great undervalue pick!

by ustation on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

One more thing we need a coach like the Leafs coach to tell these guys they stink and let the GM take a look in the mirror since he is the one that put the team together. JT comments is priceless "its not in the team's nature to be aggressive" what kind of CRAP is that, start benching those afraid of contact bums on the team. Shorten your already short bench until BC does something, JT you are only interm so what can BC do to you. This team clearly need a new culture and to recognize that they don't have it to be aggressive only opens the door for other teams to keep taking to the Raps. They couldn't even beat a Bulls team with only a 2nd year Bigs. My God.

by RAPS4LIFE on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

It's not a brain fart Mcclarky,
But I do kinda agree, because he's always well guarded and the refs put the whistle away on him. They should do more offensively, enough of the 1 on 1 stuff, or even worse 1 pass and shoot. Bosh needs to drive more and kick it back out, he never does it. Bargs has ice in his veins! Moon on the other hand...what is Moon, he's a globetrotter, do I see fancy things from him, nice dunks, basketball should come easy to him, I see none of those things.
Why do the lakers have money for gasol, odom & Kobe and Toronto not even really paying Bosh the big money yet, and we have the crappiest players.
That stat with all those guys from the raptors and no driving fouls or hard defensive fouls is sad.
I don't know what the Raptors need to do any more, except to play 48mins hard, they really need too. But I was thinking - They need to draft a player from Duke or Uconn, a player that competes and plays his heart out. For a GM that knows Europe players, I was not impressed with Solomon(why is he here), Parker is good but too nice, The guy playing in Greece I'm sure his soft as hell. Calderon and Ukic aren't BC's. But it's guys like Nicionne and Scola, those are the guys that BC should have scouted and brought in. I didn't get the game, but if you guys are feeling this way then so must BC.
Give us some news on O'Neal please, and not the HQ but someone from the team.

by Doug on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

raps4life - we had that kind coach in sam mitchell... bc still got us yet another pf instead of an sf

by axl on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

It is difficult to compare Bosh to Lebron James or Dwayne Wade simply because they play different positions.

Typically, power forwards are unlikely to be breaking people down from the top of the key and if you have a person that can do that on your team and has the skill to finish, good on ya.

People can hate on Bosh if they want, but I think I remember one poster who I would consider reasonable on another site indicating that we had the worst set of wings in the NBA by PER differential (our PER - opposing PER).

As well documented, we aren’t going to be doing anything in the playoffs until we improve the wings. They are THE problem on this team. They do not have the talent to play at a high level, end of story. It isn't a question of heart or soul, it's a question of talent. Jamario Moon provides good value for his money, but he plays for less than a million dollars a year, and HE is your starter. That right there says it all. Jason Kapono's PER is freaking 9.1 and the league average is 15. He is awful, the wing group is awful.

I think Colangelo has made some mistakes but he has shored up 3 positions in which there is less talent in the league relative to wing talent (the key to this has been Bargs' development as a legit centre). In addition, he traded Ford, Rasho and Hibbert for a decent player with a massive contract which he can now use to shore up the wing.

So in sum, this year is not our year, but we have some good looking pieces at key positions and have a nice trade chip to acquire help for our most glaring holes.

Prognosis……positive, for the future.

by Statement on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

One problem I have with the end of tight game situations, and this is from reading the recaps not actually watching last night's game, is that I wonder if the play calls for Bosh under those circumstances are more a case of stroking his ego as opposed to putting it in the hands of the player with the best chance of making the shot. Additionally, are he and the coaching staff actually "learning" from his late game disappointments? When do they start using him as a DECOY in those situations to better free up a team mate? The little things are what this team lacks in spades and that is the real source of concern going forward, even with the emergence of the Big Difference (Bargnani)

by Interloper on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Games like these simply define the Raps all too well.

They`ve been in 5 on 3 mode for quite some time. Take away our starting PG, and the situation just gets worse. Why we’ve won some games, is due to bad opposition, heroic efforts by Back-up style 2’s and 3‘s, as well as great games by BoB (Bosh or Bargnani). And for the last little while, we’ve been playing with 2 starters EVERY game – what do we expect?

Call Calderon what you want, but we need him back – and 100 % healthy. O’Neil too. Not so much to impact Andrea, but to give our Secondary a much needed injection. Our Bench is weak, because they’ve been moved up to the starting spots, and the remnants ... are just that – remnants.

I know we’re advocating some kind of change – immediately – but I can only hope BC keeps his balls intact, cause it’ll take big ones to ride out this storm. The future of this club lies in knowing when to pounce, not letting some team do it to us. As far as I’m concerned, the 09 play-offs are just a side-dish – no matter how hungry we are.

by RapthoseLeafs on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I have not seen a Raptor hit a game winning shot since the departure of MoPete. Bargnani did a nice job hitting the big three to send Boston into overtime the other day, but that is probably the first time I have seen anything resemble clutch from this team in a long, long time. Maybe we can bring back MoPete? Just kidding. Sort of.

by Flying J on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Just to add some salt to the wound, Roy's Efficiency rating (PER) is like over 24.

Moon is 14.69 and is ranked 20th.

Toronto's PER is actually a surprising 14th @ 104.5

Though I do agree that the raps posses the harder positions to fill (C/PF/PG) vs the wings.

by ustation on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I should clarify.. Moon is 20th amongst SFs

by ustation on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I believe JO cannot be traded unless there is a commitment from Bosh he is willing to stay. I guess one of the possible explanation of the apparent lack of news is due to the time needed to clarify Chris willingness to stay a raptor after 2010. If you take for granted that Andrea is going to stay, as a GM, for a pure risk management point of view you want to trade JO just if you have an assurance your other big ticket player is going to commit to your team. Andrea can play with either JO or Chris and both JO and Chris are hot chips to be plaid at the trade deadline for securing an upgrade at the SF position + spares. I believe the one thing Toronto cannot afford is to loose both Chris (next year)and JO (now). Age would suggest to keep Chris, but is he willing to stay? Examining the scenario of a Chris trade, that would secure very good players and after next year, a negotiation with JO could take place (or maybe it is being discussed right now) for a new, less expensive veteran contract. That could open a window of time were additional talent could be secured to try to contend. I believe a JO trade, while still the most probable scenario, should not be taken for granted and alternate endings may being explored right now.

by renato on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Wow,

Thanks for looking that up ustation,

It simply reaffirms the obvious.

I don't think that you need an elite wing (but it would be great, wouldn't it), but you need and upgrade over the worst wing group in the NBA ESPECIALLY since this is a league where the reffing is built to cater to the Kobes, Lebrons, and Wades of the world.

by Statement on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I don't know how I would cope with this year's team if I did not have the HQ to come to and vent with all of you guys and I really appreciate all the great post that you guys have posted today...from Franchise, VD, Howland what happen to Howland, cudos to the posters like McGateway,axl , Aaron,ustation , fromlongrange,j ,MAS,georgioh,mcclarky , moe, doug, Statement, interloper, rapthoseleafs and flying j if I miss anyone from today you too have my respect and a special thanks to ustation for all the stats...I guess patients will have to be a virtue with the 09 Raps....Raps4Life

by RAPS4LIFE on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

MAS, you describe the Raptors fans' predicament perfectly.

Aaron, when it comes to draft classes it's always best to reserve judgement, probably until after March Madness. There's lots of talent out there, and alot of times the things holding a player back relate to consistency and a break out tournament performence has elevated many a player's stock. In addition, if it really is as weak a draft as people think, then alot of players that were targeting the 2010 draft year, will move up a year to take advantage. Considering the variety of deficiencies in our roster, NO draft is so weak that we can't get something out of it.

I'm also a firm believer that a few draft spots up or down can make ALL the difference. The Sixers have done quite well for themselves be being among the worst of the non-lottery teams most years. Speights, Jason Smith, Carney.
Another advantage of being a few spots higher is being able to draft for best fit among a group of equally talented players, ie all the bigmen available in the mid to late first round of the 2008 draft.

Even with Jose and JO back, we're still a team that needs the right matchups to win in the playoffs. I find it refreshing to see our lesser lights get some minutes, and develop some confidence that will come in handy as the season progresses.(Yep, my fandom has reverted back to expansion mood, looking for silver linings in the sky) This especially relates to the point guard position, where being more sure of themselves would hopefully lead to patience and less compulsion to force shots and plays.

I agree with the thought that our team is better then its record. However, unless a good offer presents itself I want BC to wait until the deadline, or the summer. No sense making a bad deal just to squeak in to the 8th playoff seed. That's the kind of thinking that got the Maple Leafs nowhere fast.
I'd even venture the controversial idea of us being sellers at the deadline. Solicit offers for our wings that might not yield help this year, but either flexiblity for '09 /second round picks / underused young players. If philly could move Korver, I'm sure Kapono can find a home. I think Kapono is best used with two double team threats, one on the perimeter and one in the post, otherwise he's a wasted resource.

by yardly on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

BC does need to find Raptors a SF/SG who can score and make the big shot when needed. Bosh is an excellent player but its tough to make the big shot and get to the basket when you, as a PF, are the only option.
The last Rap to make a big basket winner was Calderon vs Celtics last year.
Triano must have a play with the PG having options to find the open shooter, tough to do with Ukic/Solo inexp.

The Rap's a shooting team need a floor general, PG (Calderon to run the show). He is the one indespensible player, with only Solo/Ukic inexperienced back-ups.

Rap's without JC and JO, using Ukic/Solomon are 4 wins 4 losses, with Boston & Chicago having far superior PG play as one of the reasons. I consider that not bad, although with a couple of better efforts they maybe could have won vs MIl and the 2nd Boston game, which when you consider, would have been outstanding at 6-2 without 2/5th of your starters.

Will be better to evaluate what this team is capable of with Triano when JC and JO are back at 100% effort.

by Johnn19 on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

I think YOu trade AP and a 1st for john salmons (BC first free agent target). and Trade JO for some expirings (EG Marion). YOu take that cap room and hope some team dumps a serviceable player cuz of the recession (EG camby for a 2nd round).

You use the midlevel, to sign a 3rd big or wing and you also bring delfino back, maybe AP.

Also you buy a late first round pick and draft a player with atheletism and high ceiling (eg. josh smith 22nd pick, rajon rondo etc.)

The Next Year you have

PG's - Calderon, Ukic
Wings - Delfino, Salmons, 1st pick, FA Signing
Bigs - Humph, Bosh, Bargs

I think even with Middle of the pack wings like Salmons in addition to the improved play of Bargs this team could be back in the second tier of teams in the east (Behind a declining boston, cavs, magic).

It would be interesting to see what BC would do thereafter.

by Sho on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

interesting interview with JO, I thinks it explains a bit why he hasn't been sitting on the bench (couldn't bencd his knee) and sounds like he's ok coming off the bench... should be interesting to see if he can get the second unit rolling finally

was going to post the link, but the commenting system won't let me... it's on nba broadband

by axl on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

Gentlemen(maybe some ladies too. Its hard not to feel your pain. A home game that was important to win, against a team we might be fighting for a playoff spot against.

Great points out there - Old Joe - quote of the season so far. The Toronto Pillows. Even if I don't really agree.

A really good question - who do the Raps have to give the ball to in clutch situations. Might we be missing TJ? I guess our best option was hurt, that being Jose.

Remember - before this season startrd we knew we were one injury away from trouble. If Bosh or Calderon or O'Neal went down we would be in serious trouble. Well O'Neal and Calderon are down(Heck Jose hasn't been 100% since his first hamstring pull) and have both missed considerable time for the first half. Two thirds of our so-called big 3. WE ALL KNEW WE WOULD BE IN TROUBLE !

These losses have been frustrating because we've competed. Two close games to the Celtics and a home game to the Chicago Bulls who probably played one of their best of the season(boy they looked good). Without two thirds of our so-called big 3. The blogosphere has been ripping this team - and much too harshly. Criticism of Jose who has played hurt a good part of this young seasonis unjust. You know what - point guards break down other point guards. Especially when 1 is not 100%.

by Tinman on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

effort pays off Bulls beat the Cavs in ot tonight

by Davl on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

A few loses have stung a bit more but, I agree, this one was the most disappointing.

This season we seem to be catching teams at the worst time - when they get players back or bad teams are on an up swing or we lose a player just before we face a team we should beat (just let me believe for the sake of my bball-jones survival). I remember our 47 win season and it was the complete opposite, we had horseshoes that year. Sigh.

I don't see any one of AB, CB, JC or JO going anywhere. I realize many want to use JO as the centerpiece to a trade but his contract value increases exponentially next season and/or if he can string together a month or two of solid injury free play. I also think BC is keeping his ace in the hole with Bosh. He'll be whispering to Bosh for the next year and half "stick around and convince one of your Redeemer buddies to jump the border ‘cause I have $xx million to spend". If there is a deal to be made it will be scrub for scrub to toughen this team up and/or to change the dynamic of the 2/3 positions...we just seem to have so little to offer.

Still believe the playoffs are in the cards if this team can get relatively healthy (might be a short visit however). I also hate the concept of tanking. Kills the trade value of the players on the team for the off-season, kills team moral (which can linger for years), kills fan moral and the draft is called a lottery for more than one reason. BC needs to move JK and Hump and anyone else not named above to bring some stones to the floor or Senor Calderon needs to comeback and prove he really is All-Star worthy to make this season interesting again.

by Raptoronto on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions

National Post:

It is still unclear whether Toronto Raptors centre Jermaine O'Neal will play against the Indiana Pacers on Friday night.

One thing is for sure, though: O'Neal will not start in the city where he played for eight seasons.

"He actually volunteered it to me," coach Jay Triano said. "He said, ‘I'll come off the bench and ease my way back in.' He said the big guy is rolling right now — meaning Andrea [Bargnani] — and he's been talking to him and helping him in practices and encouraging him. I just think that's a great thing for a teammate to have."

by Raptoronto on Jan 15, 2009 12:00 AM EST reply actions