Carlos Delfino – The New Mo Pete?

by RaptorsHQ - Archives on Sep 3, 2007 12:00 AM EDT in HQ International

Carlos Delfino is happy right now.

Sure his team was just waxed yesterday in the FIBA Americas final by the US once again (118-81) but with their silver medal finish, his Argentinian squad guaranteed themselves a spot at the Beijing Olympics.

To top this off, Delfino’s club was playing this tournament missing at least five of their best players and still rolled through the tournament tearing through every team except the US. Yes, they’ll be ready in Beijing.

And finally, thanks to the absence of many of these players, this tournament allowed Delfino to take center stage. He scored only nine points against the US but for the tournament he averaged almost 14, along with six rebounds and three assists. As we discussed in earlier articles, he did a bit of everything.

He also played some solid defence whenever I had the privilege of watching him and was a regular feature on many of the highlight reels during the tournament thanks to his spastic drives to the basket.

In fact it was during one of his forays to the hoop against Team Canada that I started wondering just how much the Raptors will miss Morris Peterson next season. While Peterson is slightly bigger in stature, he and Delfino have similar games being able to contribute a bit at both ends of the court with Carlos perhaps being the more athletic of the two.

Let’s take a closer look at some numbers for argument’s sake.

Last year, Peterson averaged 8.9 points, 3.3 rebounds, and less than an assist. He shot 43 per cent from the field and 36 per cent from beyond the arc in approximately 21 minutes of action a game.

Delfino for the tournament? – 13.9 points, 6.3 rebounds, and 3.3 assists. He shot 36 per cent from the field and 33.3 per cent 3-point range. From the free throw line, Delfino shot 71.4 and this was all in approximately 31 minutes a game.

At first glance it looks like Peterson is the better marksmen, with Delfino being the superior scorer, rebounder and passer.

However put over 48 minutes, the two have much closer numbers than would first appear.

Peterson would average 20 points a game while Delfino would be at about 21 points. In the rebounding department, Delfino would average close to 10 boards while Peterson would average about 8.

And in the dime dropping area? This is the area with the greatest disparity as Delfino would average about 5 assists with Peterson clocking in at about 2.

So what does this all mean?

Well, maybe nothing.

It’s tough to compare two different players as it is, and that’s before you factor in the different levels of play (the NBA vs. International Competition) or the different styles of play used by the International clubs and the rules governing them.

But if nothing else, I think fans can look at these numbers and think "hey, good luck in New Orleans Mo, but we’re going to be fine over here!"

Yes, Peterson had a great year in 05-06, but that was on a bad team and last year, it was clear to all Raptors fans that he struggled even when given opportunities. I may be the biggest Mo Pete apologist of them all, but even I felt he came to camp out of shape and just didn’t get back into the groove until the last games of the playoffs when indeed, it was too little, too late.

Delfino already looks to be able to fill in for Peterson in many statistical areas and with more playing time than he had in Detroit, and fresh off a confidence-boosting Americas’ tournament, I fully expect him to be a perfect fit for the Raptors, especially in terms of rebounding. Delfino as mentioned is a smaller player than Peterson, but he looks to have a better knack for hitting the glass and without beating a dead horse here, this is always an area where Toronto could use help.

My one concern is with Delfino’s shooting as in this tournament, he seemed to suffer from some Mike Jamesitis at times.

He, along with Luis Scola, were Argentina’s main scoring options so he perhaps had more of a green light to shoot than others…but sometimes you had to wonder about how quickly he pulled the trigger. And to top this off, Delfino seems to be as streaky a shooter as they come as his percentages from game to game demonstrate.

Eight for 15 versus Panama? Not so bad.

Three for 12 versus Brazil? Hmmmm…

My hope is that as he gets familiar with Sam Mitchell’s play-book (yes, as elaborate as it appears to be) Delfino will pick and choose his shots and use his "get to the basket" skills to establish his longer-range game.

If he can do this, Raptors fans will once again be applauding another Bryan Colangelo move once again and images of Morris Peterson circus-shots and buzzer-beaters will probably fade off into the distance.

Will Garbs be draining shots like these for Spain?

According to sources however, the Raptors have emphasized that they’d prefer if Garbajosa sat these out to complete the rehabilitation on his injured left leg, and that surgery would be the proper means of making sure he was ready to go this upcoming season for Toronto.

Garbajosa seems to disagree however and the Spanish doctors he’s been dealing with have apparently informed him that his injury can be treated by non-surgical means.

And with the help of reportedly one of "the most expensive premiums in the history of European basketball," it looks like insurance will be covering the Raptors’ investment in case of further injury.

This is a tough issue for sure.

On one hand, Garbajosa is proud player who wants badly to represent his national team, which is hosting this year’s tournament.

On the other, it’s disappointing to fans that a key player for the Raptors is risking further injury to play in a tournament that he doesn’t need to play in. Spain, by virtue of winning last summer’s World Championships, has already qualified for the Beijing Olympics.

From my perspective, I have some concerns. It would be one thing if having Garbajosa on the team was more of a token gesture due to his performance in last summer’s World’s which won his team the title, but based on Garbs’ nature, I doubt he’d go through all of this just to sit on the bench.

Therefore, I’m hoping Spain walks through these competitions thus allowing Garbajosa some much needed rest.

Because if Garbajosa ends up playing huge minutes or re-injures himself, the biggest insurance policy in the world isn’t going to conjure up another player who can duplicate what he does for Toronto.

And don’t tell me that Chris Webber is still out there…

FRANCHISE

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Let me restate this: this tournament is a huge deal in Spain, having a world champion team playing at home with a big chance to win an Eurobasket torunament makes it the most important tournament for a spanish player (in this conditions, i would dare say it's just as big as the olympics or more for the spanish players and fans). Seriously, even if Spain was not already qualified, the situation would have been exactly the same.

That said I can understand the Raps concerns regarding Garbajosa and it's probably not the safest decision for him to play, but i do think he will play in a quite limited role (15-20 min) and hopefully he'll be fine for training camp.

As for Delfino, I have been defendint his signing as a very good one from the first day, but i wouldn't expect that much offensive production from him, i think his role will be more of an all-around player who can contribute on defense, rebounds, passing rather than a regular 15ppg guy.

By the way I noticed Slokar is in the Slovenian squad, was he cut from the Raps already or is his status still uncertain?

by Sergi P on Sep 3, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Think Delfino is going to be a great fit - will turn out to be a steal for the Raps, another under the radar addition in BC's shortcut to contention.
I hope Garbajosa time is limited. While understanding the tournament being in Spain, it seems clear that the Raptors would prefer he sit. As stated, Spain has already clinched. That being said gotta love the heart he displays and will be rooting for Spain.
Two questions-
Is EuroChamps on TV?
Did I read that Andreas is hurt?

by Tinman on Sep 3, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

I don't understand how garbo can risk turning a season ending injury into a career ending one. How often is he going to play for spain if he's permanently hobbled?

by axl on Sep 3, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Spain just defeated Portugal 82-56 in a very one-sided game. Garbajosa played 18min coming from the bench, scored 8p (3/5 FG), 4 rebounds and 2 steals. Calderon played only 13min scoring 1p and giving 3 assists.

Axl, I think the injury risk is not that big. Remember he was given a 6-month recovery estimate when he went down on March 26th, so he is really only 23 days ahead of schedule which is not a huge difference.

Of course from the point of view of being strictly a Raptors fan I would not want Garbo to play at all either, so I completely understand your point, but I also see why he wants to play so badly this particular tournament, after working insanely hard the last few months it's more of an emotional thing at this point.

by Sergi P on Sep 3, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

I was a little surprised when the raps originally denied Garbo the chance to play for Spain. I understand why, but it must have taken some balls for BC to actually tell Garbs that we wouldn't let him suit up. Garbo and Jose are both clearly very proud and patriotic, so you KNOW they both were going to be there come hell or high water.

On the bright side, Garbo has never been the most athletic player and he hasn't injured his brain. I imagine all raps fans are worried that he might re-injure himself, like Franchise said, no insurance policy will replace him. But one down and no worries yet. If he does make it through, I imagine it will actually be a great tune up. Could you imagine what it he would have been like at training camp if the Raps didn't allow him to play? That also could have been problems.

Sergi, maybe you could help with this. Since we here all think that Jose is the second coming of Steve Nash, maybe you could explain why he only got 13 minutes. That sounds like a similar role as when Spain won the worlds. Would you say Jose has improved his game since the worlds or is he already near his ceiling? Who is getting the minutes at PG and what does he bring that Jose doesn't?

I was actually pretty disappointed by the numbers Delfino put up. Again, Franchise hit the nail on the head when he admitted his MoPete comparisons were flawed due to the fact that the tournament of the Americas was mainly against non NBA talent. Delfino's shooting numbers were inconsistent, or actually just not very good - against much lesser talent. I won't get into comparing his game to Mo's, but I am more worried about his acquisition since the tourney than I was before it. It looks now like he is definitely back up material, that can defend and rebound, but might have an over inflated idea of his offensive ability. That said, all we really need from him is to be a strong defending, rebounding back up. Hopefully he will be happy to be that.

Lastly, thanks to this site for getting us through this summer. Last summer was easy to be a raps fan, but this summer has been pretty slow. Still, they have found a way to keep getting regular and interesting posts up. The number of fans adding comments shows that people are catching on that this is the best Raps Blog out there. Thanks again guys and keep it coming!

by Robert Archibald on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Anyone else think Argentina's Jersey's should be burned ... oh man - I haven't seen crap like that since the 80's astros!!!

I am also curious as to who is getting the PG minutes for Spain instead of Calderon ... and why isn't this dude in the NBA?

Also - why is Steve Nash playing an exhibition game in China but doesn't want to suit up for Canada?? Is it the number of games? Any chance we see Canada's full squad for the next tourney?

by utes on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

The BC/Garbo/injury/insurance thing seems to have worked itself out for the best for everyone (a typical BC outcome). Garbo gets to play for his country (which he clearly badly wants to do), the Raps get a little insurance on him if he gets hurt, or - more likely, they get Garbo in training camp already in game condition ready to rip it up and happy with mgt for finding a way to let him play.

Win-win-win, which is very BC.

The Deflino as MoPete replacement isn't something we'll be able to project out from International tournament stats - much as we might be tempted to try - they just won't tell us what we want to know.

That said, I thought my boy Flipper had a great tournament for the most part. He had some ups and downs, (and I didn't see every game - sadly), but looked to be a solid fit at the three for us next year.

Lastly, I also didn't I hear something about Bargnani's back not being 100%? That said I also heard he went on a weight machine rampage and was ripped up like Dolph Lundgren in Rocky IV, which just means I still don't know anything. Can we get an update on Bags?

Thanks to Sergi, Franchise, etc. for all the updates!

by Bedhead on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Good news bad news on another of the Raps international players. This piece in SI sums it up.

Tyson Chandler: It would have been interesting to see what Chandler could have done with more minutes. The defensive ace recorded 14 blocks and averaged a team-low 8.6 minutes per game. Sure, he's not the most explosive offensive player (the understatement of the year), but on this team he doesn't need to be. Unfortunately for Chandler, Chris Bosh (who missed the tournament with a foot injury) does many of the same things he can and brings a lot more offense.
Grade: B-
On the one hand it looks like my concerns about Bosh taking the injury route to avoid the cut may have been unfounded as according to the reporter (Chris Mannix) he would probably take Chandler's spot next year. On the other hand, it means his injury was legit which could be a concern going into the season. So the plus side is that he probably hasn't plateaued like I originally thought but the bad news is his PF is still there.

by McGateway on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Bedhead and Robert Archibald: Sure I can explain, don't worry about Jose not getting many minutes yesterday. Jose is undoubtedly the starter at PG and the one who will get the minutes when the games matter most. The reason for his limited playing time yesterday is that it was a very one-sided game and the coach thought it'd be a good idea to give more minutes to his young backup Sergio Rodriguez (Blazers) and the lesser known Carlos Cabezas (Calderon has been in the spanish squad for many years and knows the system well). So Jose was given some rest but he is clearly the No. 1 PG in this team, not one person in the coaching staff, fans and media thinks otherwise.

As for his progression, I think since last year he has improved his game notably, particularly his mindset where he is now much more self-confident and aggressive going to the rim for his trademark layup. Also his works with (now former) Raps shooting coach Dave Hopla seems to slowly be paying off, because he has impressed everyone shooting a whopping 65% from the 3p. line in pre-tournament friendly matches. Of course the european 3p line is closer than in the NBA but still it seems to indicate that he keeps improving his shooting. I don't think he will ever reach the level of a Nash or Kidd, but he has the potential to be one of the best PG in the league if he keeps developing his game.

By the way, José now writes an Eurobasket blog (in spanish) for a local newspaper:
http://www.elmundo.es/elmundodeporte/especiales/2007/09/eurobasket/blogs/eurobasket2007_calderon/index.html

by Sergi P on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Ok, I realise this is total speculation on next years National team but here it goes. I think that if Phoenix wins the NBA title, Nash might go back to the national squad.
Here is my reasoning. Right now the main obstacle (besides Nash's dislike of BBall Canada's decision to can the old coach) is his age. Nash is getting up there in age and was getting worn down playing for Canada (especially since he was the only player who could score). This is reasonable as he gets paid to play for Phoenix and that is where his priority should be. However, if Phoneix wins the Title, then it stands to reason that Nash could take one more shot at Olympic glory. True, it would probably take another Canadian to step up their game and make it worth Nash's while to make the attempt so he doesn't feel he has to do it alone, but I think if someone did step up (paging Carl English and Mr. Brown) or Magloire finally decided to play, he might consider it. After the championship an Olympic medal would look very nice and he will be too old for the 2012 games. You have to think that him watching Kidd play and make the US look killer would weigh on his competitive mind. Just a thought as I have no evidence to back up my theory, only speculation.

by McGateway on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Ok maybe i am spamming thesite too much, but i think these updates are relevant for Raps fans:

-Spain 93-Latvia 77. Garbo 10p and 2reb in 20min (4/7 FG, 2/4 3p), Calderon 14p, 5reb and 3ass in 27min (6/12 FG, 2/4 3p). The game was a lot closer than the final result would indicate, with Biedrins leading Latvia to fight until the end.

-Italy is a big disappointment so far having lost their two games, the first unexpectedly to a decent Slovenian squad and the second to projected contenders France. Bargnani got off to a rough start with a 4p (2/10 FG, 0/2 3p) in 26min showing, but bounced back today with a 16p game (7/5 FG, 2/5 3p) in 27min.

-Croatia is 1-1 but Ukic is playing quite well under the national coach Repesa who will also be his club coach next season. He is scoring 10.5ppg in 20mpg and having an important impact in his team.

-Slovenia are a nice surprise and have won their two games, but Slokar is not playing much: 5.5ppg in 12mpg. Nesterovic is playing his usual self with 8.5ppg and 9rpg in 25mpg and 50% FG.

by Sergi P on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Thanks for all these updates, Sergi P. Let's keep our fingers crossed that Garbo won't have to exert himself too much.

It's too bad that Rasho doesn't play like a defensive beast in the NBA and that Bargs' fitness isn't that great, but I don't care much about Italy's performance as long as Bargs doesn't hurt himself further.

Oh yeah, not sure I've mentioned it before, but this is a great blog that also covers international ball, and has some pretty thorough previews of Eurobasket:

http://thepaintedarea.blogspot.com/

by jjdynomite on Sep 4, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

SergiP,
Keep the updates coming, they are greatly appreciated.

by sharpy on Sep 5, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Re Eurobasket games.
Recaps and statistics for all teams/players of interest are available at:

http://www.eurobasket2007.org

by Johnn19 on Sep 5, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

A must check-out YouTube:

http://www.thebasketballjones.net/2007/09/05/wetube-bargnani-and-belinellis-nike-ad/

Who's got a translation?

Let's hope Italy's confidence is not so fragile that they choke against Poland. So many upsets today: Slovenia over France, Portugal over Latvia, Israel over Serbia(!)-- it gives a team like Poland (or Croatia for that matter against Spain) hope that anything can happen...

by Rappy on Sep 5, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Indeed Rappy, Croatia is up by 7 against Spain with only 7m to finish the game... That would be a remarkable upset to end Spain's 28games winning streak (also 27 of those were won by 10 points or more).

by Sergi P on Sep 5, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

It's final: Spain 84-Croatia 85!!! Marko Tomas hit a 3p with 3 seconds to go, then Rudy seemed to be fouled at the buzzer but the refs didn't call it. Garbo scored 8p in 18min, I like the way he is playing providing quality minutes off the bench. Calderon scored 10 in 30min but I think his game needs to be a bit more assertive. Today we got to see the bad version of Ukic who scored 3p in only 10min and looked quite lost on the court.

I didn't get to see Italy's win against Poland, but from the stats it looks like Bargs had a very good game with 19p and 7reb in only 22min.

by Sergi P on Sep 5, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

lol Sergi P you are a real bb junkie - I love it and keep those updates comming
Thanks

by ZoneD on Sep 5, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Sergi P

U said U did not get to see Italy's win against Poland

are U watching these games? If so where? thanks

by Davl on Sep 6, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Well Davl, i have an easy answer: i live in Spain :-)

Basketball is not usually broadcasted a lot here in Spain (compared to soccer), but with the championship craze we now have a national channel playing all games live. They even go back and forth between games when they're played at the same time (focusing more on the most interesting), it's a really fantastic time to be a hoops fan here in Spain, this 100% coverage is like a dream.

Anyway, I also read somewhere that there's an official website broadcasting the games online, I think it's for a small fee but i've never actually tried myself so i can't tell you if the quality is decent enough or wether it works at all. Here is the link anyway:
http://www.mediazone.com/channel/basketball/eurobasketMen2007/index.jsp

by Sergi P on Sep 6, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Sergi

Thanks for the link I will try it and I think I remember U living in Spain. Enjoy the games

by Davl on Sep 6, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

A 79-70 triumph over Poland was enough to see Italy progress to the qualifying round at the EuroBasket.

Guard Marco Belinelli had a game-high 20 points for the winning side while forward Andrea Bargnani added 19 points - 16 of which came in the first half.

How many times have we seen Andrea have a great first half then next to nothing? Hopefully its a trend we won't see too often

by Davl on Sep 6, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions

Carlos Delfino the new mo Pete
not even close come on Mo Pete
was and still is better then Carlos Delfino. Carlos Delfino
please do not waste my time with this he is a never will be . Come on give Mo pete more credit then this

by peter doucette on Oct 23, 2007 12:00 AM EDT reply actions